1842 Springfield lock

[TNSharps55]

I have a complete original lock for an 1842 Springfield marked Harpers Ferry and dated 1843. The earliest date I've seen on a '42 so far was 1844. Does anyone know the date of first manufacture for the model 1842?

[John Gross]

Robert M. Reilly writes in "United States Military Small Arms";

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Harper's Ferry muskets of this type [Model 1842] are known bearing dates as early as 1843, while the earliest known on a Springfield arm is 1844, very probably the dates during which production began at each location.
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John Gross

I have a complete original lock for an 1842 Springfield marked Harpers Ferry and dated 1843. The earliest date I've seen on a '42 so far was 1844. Does anyone know the date of first manufacture for the model 1842?

[R. McAuley 3014V]

I will leave it up to you whether you can believe Reilly that there are examples of Harpers Ferry muskets of the Model 1842 bearing dates of 1843, but you might want to look at insuring your 1843 Harpers Ferry for a much higher price, if it is actually not 1848?

While I have certainly seen a 1844-dated Harpers Ferry lock (see link below), Merritt Roe Smith (1980) Harpers Ferry Armory and the New Technology (p281) states:

Ironically, Harpers Ferry, the place where the Model 1840 had originated, never produced the weapon. Instead the armory continued to make old Model 1816 flintlocks until the spring of 1845 when it switched to the Warner designed percussion musket.

This statement is supported by the Ordnance Department Return, dated 01 Nov 1844:

Sir: I have the honor to submit the following report of the operations of the Ordnance Department during the fiscal year ending 30th June last:

There have been completed at these armories and turned into stores, the following small-arms and accoutrements:

At Harpers Ferry, 608 flint lock muskets, 2,700 Hall’s rifles, 1 musketoon. 1 model percussion-rifle, 15,315 wipers; 73 ball screws, 304 spring vices; 3,123 screw-drivers, and 3,191 bullet-molds.

At Springfield, 4,701 flint-lock muskets, 3,200 percussion muskets, 8,529 wipers, 430 ball-screws, 2,059 spring-vices, 17,083 screw-drivers, and 1,230 flint-caps. In addition to which, a large amount of component parts of arms was manufactured at both armories, which remained in the workshops not assembled or put together so as to form complete arms.

http://www.civilwarpreservations.com/ca ... pe=muskets

[John Holland]

Richard,

Welcome back! And, thank you for the informative reply to the question on the Harper's Ferry M-1842. Although I too have read the references to their existance, I have never actually seen an 1843 dated M-1842 Harper's Ferry Musket lock.

Perhaps "TNSharps55" could post a photo sometime? If so, I would like to be able to add the definitive information to the SAC archives if possible.

TNSharps55, feel free to contact me direct through the email tab at the bottom with a photo if you are able to do so. Or anyone else who may have a 1843 dated M-1842 H.F. lock!

JDH
SAC

[Phil Spaugy, 3475V]

John,

I will second your "welcome back" to Richard. He adds a lot of knowledge to our bulletin board.

Phil

[John Holland]

To the Model 1842 Enthusiasts -

"TNSharps55" was kind enough to send me photo's of the lock in question. And, now there is NO question about it! It is definately a 1843 dated Harper's Ferry M-1842 lock, and in quite nice condition, too.

The owner has said he is willing to post the pic's on the BB if someone can guide him through it. I'm not the person! Believe me, they are worth seeing.

I am delighted to be able to add this positive information to the Small Arms Committee's data base. Thank you, "TNSharps55".

John Holland
Chairman, Small Arms Committee

[RaiderANV]

I'll trade him ah Maynard fer it :?:

Green

[Muley Gil]

If you put your pictures on a remote site (I use photobucket), then click on the URL and copy it. Type in [img],%20paste%20the%20URL,%20followed%20by[/img], then hit "enter", your photo SHOULD appear.

Like this:

[John Gross]

Just for the record, I have seen an 1843 dated Harper's Ferry Model 1841 Mississippi rifle. Dave Taylor had it for sale several years ago.

John Gross

[R. McAuley 3014V]

To attempt an explanation anent how such an item might have come about requires us to literally “read between the lines." In the previous ordnance return, dated 1 Nov 1843, had reported expenditures at the armories from 30 Sept 1842 to 30 June 1843 the manufacture of arms, material, and “component parts of arms” at Harpers Ferry, of $89,167.33 while expenditures at Springfield for the same categories cost $69,349.55. Additionally, some $29,527 was spent on improvements at Harpers Ferry versus $15,466 at Springfield Armory. These improvements at Harpers Ferry correspond to the construction of a new rifle factory together with building a new house for the superintendent (per interviews).

The return further reports: “there have been manufactured at these armories, and delivered into store during the same period, 7,705 muskets, 301 rifles, and 1,001 carbines; and progress has been made in the fabrication of parts of the percussion muskets; the expense of which, and the providing materials, are embraced in the above statement.”

Based upon this information, together with that noted in the 1844 return, at least a portion of the parts for the new model (i.e. Model of 1842) percussion musket were manufactured before the spring of 1845 when the production of complete arms commenced at Harpers Ferry Armory.

Springfield Armory (1835-1845)
Fiscal year ending – For lands, buildings, and new machinery – For manufacture of arms, including tools, repairs of machinery, models, salaries, etc (Quantities and model of arms manufactured)

Dec 31, 1835 - $19,687.00 - $141,845.41 (13,000 M1816)
Dec 31, 1836 - $28,443.46 - $159,159.08 (13,500 M1816)
Dec 31, 1837 - $23,570.84 - $200,594.92 (14,500 M1816)
Dec 31, 1838 - $2,699.03 - $185,121.85 (15,000 M1816)
Dec 31, 1839 - $6,956.59 - $121,890.10 (10,000 M1816)
Dec 31, 1840 - $13,844.06 - $121,642.51 (5,267 M1816 & 700 M1840)
Mar 31, 1841 - $2,211.46 - $117,823.25 (4,500 M1840)
(Military superintendency of Major J.W. Ripley, beginning April 1841):
Sept 30, 1841 - $8,864.33 - $87,846.73 (10,700 M1840)
Sept 30, 1842 - $15,362.36 - $140,769.56 (9,720 M1840)
June 30, 1843 - $15,466.58 - $63,349.55 (4,600 M1840)
June 30, 1844 - $38,098.97 - $101,141.73 (4,701 M1840, 2,956 M1842)
June 30, 1845 - $28,341.20 - $144,706.04 (12,107 M1842, 300 M1842 cadet perc muskets)

Harpers Ferry Armory (1835-1845)
Fiscal year ending – For lands, buildings, and new machinery – For manufacture of arms, including tools, repairs of machinery, models, salaries, etc (Quantities and model of arms manufactured, repaired, etc)

Dec 31, 1835 - $23,088.60 - $157,714.15 (10,000 M1816, 1,714 Hall’s rifles)
Dec 31, 1836 - $15,246.75 - $180,388.26 (9,150 M1816, 1,809 Hall’s rifles)
Dec 31, 1837 - $75,849.37 - $222,341.05 (8,200 M1816, 1200 Hall’s rifles, 1,017 carbines)
Dec 31, 1838 - $52,324.34 - $162,879.65 (12,000 M1816, 2,934 Hall’s rifles)
Dec 31, 1839 - $26,752.49 - $155,634.93 (5,850 M1816)
Dec 31, 1840 - $32,556.20 - $145,509.67 (8,304 M1816, 1,023 Hall’s rifles, 1,003 carbines)
Mar 31, 1841 - $17,842.28 - $73,081.63 (3,800 M1816)
(Military superintendency of Major H.K. Craig, beginning April 1841)
Sept 30, 1841 - $15,631.91 - $113,007.69 (8,600 M1816, 190 Hall’s rifles)
Sept 30, 1842 - $28,105.91 - $124,411.41 (6,575 M1816)
June 30, 1843 - $34,433.65 – 83,840.94 (3,105 M1816, 301 Hall’s rifles, 1,001 carbines)
June 30, 1844 - $35,480.37 - $93,518.42 (608 M1816, 2,700 Hall’s rifles, 1 carbine, 1 M1841 model rifle)
June 30, 1845 - $29,696.86 - $138,556.18 (2,225 M1842, 1 M1841 model rifle)

[Reports of Committees of the House of Representatives, made during the First Session of the Thirty-Third Congress(1854), Vol. 2, No. 191]