Bullet/Load for P-H Volunteer

[B-Davis]

Hello!
I recently traded for a P-H Volunteer rifle. It is .451 with Henry rifling. Does anyone here have expirence shooting one of these? If so what bullet\powder charge combination is effective for you? At the moment I am only looking at shooting up to 100/150 yards. I am not worried for 300,400,or 600 yds at this time. I went to the British Militaria forums, and some individuals are using just pistol round balls with 40 grains of powder, does this sound realistic?
Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated!
Bryan Davis

[Pat in Virginia]

Bryan,

Robyn was looking for the same bullet recommendation as you are. The following are excerpts from several exchanges in more than one topic on the LRML Forum. Robyn was very happy with his results with the recommended bullet.

Originaly posted on LRML (Long Range Muzzle Loading) Forum - Fall, 2011

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Robyn, here's some info I posted as a source for P-Gibb's bullet moulds updated to reflect your location. You will find moulds that drop bullets in the right diameter range for your volunteer.

Re: Gibbs Bullet
Reply #1 - Jul 20th, 2011 at 1:57am

You can order such a mould from Buffalo Arms Company in the US. I assume they will ship to OZ for a price. They have a number of moulds in PP and GG that should work. See

http://www.buffaloarms.com/Grease_Groove_.42-.45_caliber_pr-4157.aspx?CAT=4157 and
http://www.buffaloarms.com/Products.aspx?CAT=3852

In the grease grove category, look particularly hard at the one labeled Shaver. That is a bullet design by Lee Shaver especially for ML. He told me he has set several international records with it. Most of the other GG bullets, if not all, were designed for cartridge rifles. Lee's bullet design has at least two calibers of bearing surface and the smaller number of GG coupled with the decreased depth he specified may very well help to keep drag down. The bullet is a bit heavier than most, but I wouldn't let that stop me if I wanted to go GG. Lee says he uses a .060 card wad under the bullet. The bullet is specified at .448 diameter. In a Volunteer you will want to use pure (soft) lead because of the deep rifling so you can expect more shrinkage than someone casting with a 30:1 alloy which is what that mould is probably sized for. So you may want to ask if they can make it for you to drop at .450 with pure/soft lead. I believe they lathe bore their moulds so that may not be hard for them to do. A bullet sized at .450 is just right for my UK-made PH-volunteer.

[Buffalo Arms now sells the bullet in 575, 535, and 500 grains. They don’t make custom moulds, only what they offer in their on-line catalog, but they will entertain ideas that would seem to have commercial promise.

In this case, with Whitworth or Henry rifling you need to order the next larger diameter than your bore size to allow for the extra shrinkage (.0005)of the soft lead you should be casting your bullets with for the Volunteer or Whitworth.]
Pat
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Hi Pat
thank you for getting me that info.
I have emailed Lee Shaver and got the following reply that you may be interested in:

HI Robyn,

My bullet design is kind of "old School" as it goes with a lot of weight and a lot of bearing surface on the sides to make sure it is aligned properly with the bore. It is 38mm long so it will stabilize in a 20 inch twist or faster, but I would not use the 20 twist for extreme ranges. It is nearly perfect for an 18" twist, but I use it in my 16" twist with great success at all distances.
I have shot some very nice one hole groups with it at 100 yards, and yet set our 800 yard national record with it as well.

It weighs about 575 grains with 20-1 alloy, so it is a heavy one for short range, but it will certainly work well.

Actually for short range I would be tempted to have a version made that was about 500 gr... especially if your volunteer rifle has a slower twist....... but a South African friend of mine just used it ( in the full weight size) to win a gold silver and bronze at their short range nationals, and help win a couple of team medals as well, so it certainly works well as it is.


Hope that helps,


Lee

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Hi All
Just a quick report on progress with the volunteer rifle. After many months of frustation, tears and bad language and a heap of help from members on this site... It shoots!!!! with the new 500 g lee shaver bullet from buffalo arms ( thanks to Pat for arranging the custom build) All I can say is wow!!!! with no practice , no sighters, I entered the state championships here in NSW australia (100 yard 1 inch bull)...I had a guess at the sight setting and powder load and managed to score of 93.1 out of 100 giving me third place behind two gibbs rifles that scored 94.1 and 94.3 ... Now I know this is far from long range , but for the first time out with the bullet I am very happy.. the remainder of the field were gibbs and custom rifles.... with very experenced shooters.. All I can say is thank you to the members here for without your help this rifle would of been used for a cricket bat....
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Robyn,

I'm delighted with you results! Many congratulations!!!

I forwarded you note to Dave Gullo and Lee Shaver. I think they will appreciate it very much.

I think they are going to Bisley for the LRML World Championships soon, but this will catch up to them at some point.

Thanks, for your feed back. I've got another bullet I would like Buffalo Arms to do that should be great in the Volunteer and Whitworth rifles. Maybe Dave will be more disposed to help me with that one now.

For long range, don't forget the 575 grain version of that same bullet. Lee uses it at 1000 yards.

[I believe the 535 grain is in the BA catalogue now and that should be tried at mid-range (out to 600 yards. It will be easier on your shoulder.]

Also, don't keep us in suspence, what load did you use: wt and type of powder; wad - if any; lube; etc.

Pat
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Hi
I forgot to give the load details:
451 500 grain lee shaver bullet
80 grains of wano P powder
60 thou over powder wad (cardboard)
lube 50/50 beeswax and Neutrogena soap
regards robyn
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Hi there Robyn,

I too have ordered the same mould and as I shoot the same rifle as you, I am following this conversation very closely.... I am itching to try it out but I am someplace sandy right now and am away from the oportunity to shoot my Volunteer... One further question, pure lead or alloy?

Thanks,

Rob
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HI
to answer your question
pure soft lead it will cast at 450.5 which is a perfect fit for my volunteer... you will be surprized the difference the bullet makes to the rifle....
any question just ask
regards Robyn
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And, that’s all folks,

Pat

[Space Cowboy]

Bryan,
I have been using a PH Volunteer on MLAIC international matches for 10 years now with good resuts. I use 450 grain Lyman 451114 bullets sized to .451 with 60 grains of Swiss 3Fg. It's a simple load, but works fine. With this the rifle is capadble of hole-in-hole accuracy.
SC