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Thread: Smoothbore with rear sight?

  1. #11
    Muley Gil is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Gaul View Post
    H and P are very popular but you have to be careful. The position of the rear sight is key to finding a legal NSSA sighted smoothbore. If the H and P has a rear sight pointing in the usual direction, and there is no clean out screw, and there is a "shark fin" front sight on the front barrel band, and unaltered as to length and other specs., you most likely to have a legal, SAC passing, H and P in its unaltered state. If the H and P has the sight pointing in the reverse direction, and there is clean out screw, mostly likely you a H and P made for the State of New Jersey and is rifled. You can still use it in the NSSA but not in Smoothbore competition. There are members who shoot a rifled 69 cal musket in musket competition. It is personal preference for them. Most of us use the standard 54 or 58 cal musket from 55 to 64 type II or Enfield or whatever.

    There is even a short version of the Potsdam floating around the gun show circuit. Do you want to destroy a Civil War Potsdam by relining it and now it is a "Skirmish" smoothbore firearm? Decisions? Decisions?


    I defer to members of the SAC committee for clarification. After 42 years in the organization, this has been my experience.

    Harry in Pa.
    03626v
    Back when I started in the N-SSA (1970) the .69 muskets were popular for the stake event. I saw some awesome .69 full wadcutter bullets being used.
    Gil Davis Tercenio
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    Great, great grandson of Cpl Elijah S Davis, Co I, 6th Alabama Inf CSA

  2. #12
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    One final question

    Can it be legally (N-ssa use) be converted to a Smoothbore?
    Jim Willauer
    CV-011 Cockade Rifles

  3. #13
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    Can it be legally (N-ssa use) be converted to a Smoothbore?
    I think it is legal to build "put-together" guns from original parts, but it would be difficult to convert a NJ rifled conversion to look like an H&P conversion.

    First of all, you would need a new barrel and breech. I'm working on reproduction H&P breeches right now and should have a fully machined prototype in a couple of weeks.

    Next, you would probably need a new lock plate so that you could shape the flash pan notch to match the shape of the belly of the H&P bolster, as it probably won't match the shape of the notch put in for the NJ bolster.

    Depending on the year model you might need a different hammer also.

    I know the N-SSA frowns on destroying old guns for parts but I believe you could do it but it would be a lot of work. You probably could build an H&P conversion musket out of parts if you had an H&P barrel.

    I hope to have this problem solved with a reproduction H&P by the end of the year.

    Steve
    Steve Sheldon
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  4. #14
    John Holland is offline Moderator
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    The wholesale destruction of original Civil War arms to create another arm to skirmish with was dealt with at a National Board meeting when it was discovered that over 100 original M-1816 Cone-in-Barrel muskets had been destroyed to fabricate replicas of H&P smoothbore muskets. Those muskets, which were the backbone of both the Union and the Confederacy in the early days of the Civil War, have been irreparably lost to history forever. It was decided by the Board that the N-SSA that the Small Arms Committee would no longer issue Individual Approval Cards for an arm that was fabricated by destroying an original Civil War arm. The very tenets of the N-SSA are the preservation of Civil War arms, accouterments, and memorabilia.

  5. #15
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    Could you get a card for one built from parts?

    Steve
    Steve Sheldon
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  6. #16
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    Harry Gaul is offline
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    is grandfather around?

    SAC,

    Since these altered 1816's to H and P"s with SAC card are around and used, are they grandfathered in for competition?
    I am asking just in case one of these smoothies comes on the market.

    Harry in Pa.
    03626v

  7. #17
    John Holland is offline Moderator
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    Steve - Yes, but be prepared to prove it was from an assortment of odd parts. Photos of the parts and process to completion would be best to support your case for not having destroyed an original arm.

    Harry, yes they are "Grandfathered in and must have either the original or a copy of the SAC card with them whenever used on an N-SSA official firing line. I strongly suggest keeping a copy of the original card in a safe place.

  8. #18
    Brian is offline
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    Potsdam option

    An easy solution would be to just buy my original Potsdam.
    750$ and it will be at the Allegheny regional

  9. #19
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    H & P

    I wont destroy the original that I bought. The only question is , am I going to keep it or pass it on. Is there an SAC build sheet for the Potsdam and H & P Smoothbores?

    Thank you
    Jim Willauer
    CV-011 Cockade Rifles

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