Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 13

Thread: Combustible cartridge conundrum

  1. #1
    Dave Fox is offline
    Team:
    Visitor (non-N-SSA Member)
    Member
    NA
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Hendersonville, N.C.
    Posts
    318
    Region:
    Visitor

    Combustible cartridge conundrum

    In my declining years I've developed a fondness for acquiring and shooting CW carbines. Cannot get the Burnside to work correctly, but that's another story. Especially enjoy the paper cartridge carbines. Charlie Hahn's cardboard tubes work as advertised in my Sharps, exiting the barrel in a seemly manner when the gun goes off. The difficulty is with my Merrill, Gwyn & Campbell, and Starr. The paper cartridges tend to stay mostly intact in the breeches after firing. I've made a sort of hook to extract them. I've used commercial nitrated paper from DGW and 1950s rag bond from my Dad's office liberally soaked in potassium nitrate. Other people don't seem to have this problem. What might I be doing wrong?
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  2. #2
    mgmradio is offline
    Team:
    Visitor (non-N-SSA Member)
    Member
    NA
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    126
    Region:
    Visitor
    The Gwyn and Campbell and the Starr used linen cartridges. These are photos of the ones I make and shoot . They burn up completely and only occasionally leave small carbon flakes.
    Attached Images Attached Images   

  3. #3
    Greg Ogdan 110th OVI is offline
    Team:
    110th Ohio Voluneer Infantry
    Member
    11444V
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Dayton, Ohio
    Posts
    196
    Region:
    Midwest - Ohio, Kentucky and Indiana
    Your paper is too thick and/or not enough nitrate. Try 14 lb legal pad paper and tracing paper for the end cap. Works for me.

    Greg

  4. #4
    Muley Gil is offline
    Team:
    34th Battalion Virginia Cavalry
    Member
    3020V
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Southwest Virginia
    Posts
    1,676
    Region:
    New England - New York, Connecticut, New Jersey and Massachusetts
    I've never tried it, but I have read of folks using rolling papers for combustible cartridges.
    Gil Davis Tercenio
    # 3020V
    34th Battalion, Virginia Cavalry
    Great, great grandson of Cpl Elijah S Davis, Co I, 6th Alabama Inf CSA

  5. #5
    geezmo is offline
    Team:
    120th New York Volunteer Infantry
    Member
    1761V
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Mid Hudson Valley
    Posts
    347
    Region:
    New England - New York, Connecticut, New Jersey and Massachusetts
    Quote Originally Posted by mgmradio View Post
    The Gwyn and Campbell and the Starr used linen cartridges. These are photos of the ones I make and shoot . They burn up completely and only occasionally leave small carbon flakes.
    Your linen looks pretty fine. What is your source for that? Is it still available?

    Thanks in advance,
    Barr S.

  6. #6
    geezmo is offline
    Team:
    120th New York Volunteer Infantry
    Member
    1761V
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Mid Hudson Valley
    Posts
    347
    Region:
    New England - New York, Connecticut, New Jersey and Massachusetts
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Fox View Post
    In my declining years I've developed a fondness for acquiring and shooting CW carbines. Cannot get the Burnside to work correctly, but that's another story. Especially enjoy the paper cartridge carbines. Charlie Hahn's cardboard tubes work as advertised in my Sharps, exiting the barrel in a seemly manner when the gun goes off. The difficulty is with my Merrill, Gwyn & Campbell, and Starr. The paper cartridges tend to stay mostly intact in the breeches after firing. I've made a sort of hook to extract them. I've used commercial nitrated paper from DGW and 1950s rag bond from my Dad's office liberally soaked in potassium nitrate. Other people don't seem to have this problem. What might I be doing wrong?
    Dave,

    I've had similar results with the Merrill during minimal experimentation. I've used curler paper, which is pretty thin, and folded the end over like originals leaving several layers at the base. Tried using Elmer's glue sparingly. I get a fair amount of cartridge base and some of longitudinal seam left over. I've thought about trying different glues and just rolling a tube and inserting tissue base like a Sharps but haven't had the chance to.

  7. #7
    Kevin Tinny is offline
    Team:
    Tammany Regiment, 42nd New York
    Member
    13667
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    North Florida
    Posts
    573
    Region:
    New England - New York, Connecticut, New Jersey and Massachusetts
    Hello, Dave:

    If you can receive PM's, I just tried to send one.
    Please look and signal me. Tx.

    VR/Kevin Tinny
    Tammany Rgt, 42NY 13667

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Huntsville
    Posts
    3,733
    Region:
    Deep South - Georgia, Louisiana, Tennessee, Mississippi and Texas
    I'd love to see a youtube video or other tutorial on how to make your linen cartridges. They look perfect!

    Steve
    Steve Sheldon
    Commander
    4th Louisiana Delta Rifles
    NRA Certified Muzzleloading Instructor

  9. #9
    mgmradio is offline
    Team:
    Visitor (non-N-SSA Member)
    Member
    NA
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    126
    Region:
    Visitor
    Geezmo,
    The linen cartridges in the photos are made with drafting linen. They are 2 layers thick and have onion skin paper bases inserted. The drafting linen is 0.005? thick as was the original linen used in the Starr and Sharps cartridges. It is very hard to find as it hasn?t been made for 70 or so years. The roll that I have is actually cotton I believe instead of real linen. The thinnest modern linen I have been able to find runs between 0.009-0.011? thick and the tread count is very low, almost a gauze. The pure linen does burn more completely than the cotton, but that doesn?t make much difference as the cotton usually burns completely.
    The original glues used were either Gum Aribic or shellac glue.

  10. #10
    mgmradio is offline
    Team:
    Visitor (non-N-SSA Member)
    Member
    NA
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    126
    Region:
    Visitor
    I would like to try and clear up some confusion on the use of the word combustible cartridges. During the mid 1800?s there were many advances in they types of cartridges made one was the combustible cartridge. These were made using different methods and materials. Gun cotton was one of the materials used for propellant and cartridge. Another was pressed powder pellet with either a paper or coloidian impregnated paper covering. Also a coloidian shell with powder inside. Some of the earliest Hazard company combustible cartridges were just a powder pellet glued to the bullet base then dipped in bees wax.
    There is no known government documents that show any of the Civil War era cartridges used nitrated paper or linen. Sharps gave a list of what was used in making its cartridges for the government and makes no mention of nitrates other than black powder.

Similar Threads

  1. Gallagher conundrum & Moose Moulds
    By Dave Fox in forum Small Arms
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 05-08-2020, 02:46 PM
  2. Durable combustible cartridge?
    By Naphtali in forum Small Arms
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 06-24-2015, 01:51 PM
  3. Combustible paper revolvers cartridges
    By jaxenro in forum Shooting Techs, Tips, & Tricks
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 10-20-2013, 07:38 AM
  4. WTT: .58 Cal. cartridge box for .69 cal.
    By Cannonsight in forum Wanted/For Sale Items
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 05-20-2013, 08:51 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •