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Thread: 140th National, Why Did We Have 2 Phases of Musket Team?

  1. #1
    John Holland is offline Moderator
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    140th National, Why Did We Have 2 Phases of Musket Team?

    Here is yet another observation, and a suggestion to the Co-Program Staff Officers. At the August 2019 Board of Directors Meeting it was proposed that we return to one phase for the National Musket Team Match. The discussion ended with "We can't do that, because the positions would be too crowded with 3 relays all on the same position." Therefore it was voted down.

    What I have to say is "Seriously?" We shoot the Carbine Team Match on Saturday with 3 relays on the same position, with the same targeting, and the same 300 second events. Nobody has a problem with that, so why the "Hue & Cry" against doing the same thing for the Sunday Musket Team Match? The positions won't be any more crowded than they were for the Carbine Team Match, which nobody complains about. In fact, the Rule change that now permits us to place our equipment back to the fence has given each position an additional 150 square feet!

    By returning to 3 relays for the Musket Team Match we will be able to begin the Awards Ceremony during what is now the 1st Relay of Phase 2 Musket. That means that the outlying teams who win Musket Team Medals can leave for their long drive home several hours earlier than they can now under the 2 Phase System. In addition to that, the Host Staff would be able finish up their duties long before Phase 2 would be over, so that they too could leave for home hours earlier than they can now.

    John Holland, Skirmisher

  2. #2
    Muley Gil is offline
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    It makes sense to me John.
    Gil Davis Tercenio
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    Great, great grandson of Cpl Elijah S Davis, Co I, 6th Alabama Inf CSA

  3. #3
    rgsheppard is offline
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    On our position, we had 3 Carbine teams, thus 3 relays. For Phase 2 Musket, we had 2 Musket Teams for 2 Relays. I assume that during Phase 1 there were also 2 Musket Teams on our Position. If only one Musket Phase, that would put 4 Musket Teams on some positions, requiring 4 relays, and 8 more shooters with equipment and gear than what existed for Carbine. Safety would be a huge issue.

    Hope you followed the math.
    R. GARY SHEPPARD
    Adjutant

    Co C, 2nd US Sharpshooters


  4. #4
    John Bly is offline
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    The phase 1 musket match went to position 67. The phase 2 match went to position 34. Assuming two teams on each position, twice 34 is 68 so we were very close to being able to go to one phase. Two positions in front of the tower are left empty. There were only 159 teams that competed. 159 divided by 3 is 53 so they would all fit, but there were a lot of no-shows. There was a lot of unused target material on each phase that had to be moved to the ready area so as not to be in the way of shooters.

    If the organization keeps shrinking then going to one phase is feasible. Let's hope we don't shrink any more.

  5. #5
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    There are 66 positions ( 64 places) two positions in the middle near the tower are empty. 64 times 3 is 192 teams. Did 192 teams or less compete in Musket at Nationals? For the record how many useable positions for skirmishing on the line? TBDH Harry 03626v


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    Harry Gaul's Avatar
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    John Bly said it best. TBDH. Harry 03626v


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  7. #7
    lmcmahon's Avatar
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    We had 191 musket teams registered for the 140th. We did not use positions 23, 24 and 67. If we use all 67 positions, we could have 201 teams shooting one phase musket. We know at least 7 to 8 weeks in advance of each national whether we will exceed the 201 teams. The idea has been floated around of going to one phase. If the current trend continues there is no reason not to go to a single phase. We could start an hour later and be finished by one o?clock. Award ceremony by 2 pm.

    Carbine match is three relays, three teams on each position with no problems. Let?s also talk about smoothbore. Smoothbore teams need to be increased to 6 shooters, one team per position and two relays.
    Just my two cents!
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  8. #8
    jonk is offline
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    If we have the space, I see no issue in doing it in one phase. My concern is, everyone registers expecting one phase and we have a particularly good turn out that won't quite fit on one phase.

    Right now we could do it, barely.

    My thought is: leave it as it sits for now. If we gain more teams (either new teams or more B/C teams) all the better, 2 phases are needed. If we lose more teams (sad but likely) and we get a little more buffer... then move it all to one phase.

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    It would be a shame to make such a change and then have to immediately change back due to the number of teams wanting to shoot, but by the same token, if we continue our numerical contraction we are currently experiencing, it would certainly be more efficient to have a single phase, plus the fact that we would all shoot under the same conditions of weather, light conditions, etc.

    I think this may be a worthwhile consideration if the numbers work and no team gets left unable to shoot.

    Froggie
    Charlie Shaeff
    1st Valley Rangers
    N-SSA # 12345

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    3 Relays.

    Makes perfect sense. How many teams did we actually have on the line? How many teams usually scratch when conditions arent perfect? Wouldnt one phase make it easier for the host teams?
    Jim Willauer
    CV-011 Cockade Rifles
    Lt Col Robert H Archer Camp 2013 SCV

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