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Thread: Plastic Smith tubes with brass rivet

  1. #41
    CAGerringer is offline
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    Just out of curiosity...how much does Bobby charge to reline a Pietta Smith? I too, have an area of less resistance half way down the barrel, when running a slug down it. I'm very interested how this story plays out!
    Respectfully,
    Charlie Gerringer
    Old Dominion Dragoons

  2. #42
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    Well, I got my cleaning rod from S&S today, I ordered a .50 caliber, think I got a .52, as the jag measures .51 in diameter and neither the jag nor the plastic bushing will fit in the barrel of my Smith. I've emailed them to see if they can just send me the jag and the bushing.

    I also got 100 black tubes. I ordered the aluminum pop-rivets from Grainger. I also ordered the brass ones from Northeast Trading Company but they have not come in yet. The aluminum ones you can push out the rivet shank easily, and then I pushed the grommet into the end of the plastic tube. I started it with my fingers, and then put it in my bench vice and pressed it home.



    Full-sized picture here: https://imgur.com/a/QZSiiUY

    The black plastic Smith cases are much more rigid than the Yore tubes, which are quite rubbery. I can see why you would chamfer the inside of the case mouth on these black tubes. It was much harder to press in a bullet by hand and to start it. I suspect when I size to .515 it will be easier. Still waiting on my sizing die to come in.

    The black smith tube was harder to chamber in my Smith than the Yore tube also. The OD is bigger. Again when the bullet is sized down this may no longer be an issue.

    Steve
    Steve Sheldon
    Commander
    4th Louisiana Delta Rifles
    NRA Certified Muzzleloading Instructor

  3. #43
    bobanderson is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAGerringer View Post
    Just out of curiosity...how much does Bobby charge to reline a Pietta Smith? I too, have an area of less resistance half way down the barrel, when running a slug down it. I'm very interested how this story plays out!
    Respectfully,
    Charlie Gerringer
    Old Dominion Dragoons
    A reline should be a last ditch solution. I would fire lap the barrel to reduce tool marks, smooth out high spots and greatly improve accuracy.
    For the uninitiated, firelapping involves shooting lead bullets coated with very fine abrasive such as valve grinding compound to polish the barrel. When you feel less and then more resistance pushing a slug down the bore, you are feeling high spots as little as 1/2 of a 10 thousandth (.00005). To make firelapping rounds, use hard lead bullets and roll them between two glass plates/ceramic tiles with lapping compound. This presses the compound into the bullet, making a "lap". Load a cartridge with a light charge of the fastest burning powder you have. With black, I'd say 10 to 15 grains of 4f. You want enough to get the bullet out of the muzzle. (With my 40-65 Sharps, I used 5 grains of Bullseye, but DON'T DO THAT IN A SMITH!!!!!)
    Anyway, take about 5 shots, clean the bore, then another 5. After 20 shots, push a slug down the bore and feel the start and stop as the slug encounters high spots. (Lead Bullet Technologies suggested about 20-30 rounds, I used 80 in my Sharps.)

    Lather, rinse and repeat.

    This will also work to freshen up a dark or slightly pitted barrel.

    NOTE OF CAUTION - I'm relating this based on my increasingly poorer memory and something I did about 25 years ago. Do your due diligence and see what instructions you can get online. After typing this long missive, I looked and LBT is still in business and still sells borelapping kits and push through slugs. http://lbtmolds.com/Products/tabid/5806/Default.aspx

    Just the project to tackle during our forced hiatus.

    Stay safe and wash your hands.
    Bob Anderson
    Ordnance Sergeant
    Company C, 1st Michigan Volunteer Infantry
    Small Arms Committee

    "I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a hand on.
    I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them."
    - John Wayne in "The Shootist", 1976

  4. #44
    CAGerringer is offline
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    Thanks, Bob.
    I've contacted LBT to get some info and prices on their Lapping kits and supplies.
    Respectfully,
    Charlie Gerringer
    Old Dominion Dragoons

  5. #45
    Kevin Tinny is offline
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    Thanks for remembering firelapping:

    I can second your experience.
    It does work and is a practical alternative to lining.
    Do the least radical thing. Can line if won't help.

    Regards.
    Kevin

  6. #46
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    So tonight I got all my North East Trading Company brass grommets into my black Smith tubes. I decided to go with the NETC grommets instead of the pop rivets for two reasons. First, they are "plug and play" - you don't have to pull the aluminum shaft out of each pop rivet. Second, the flash hole in the brass grommets is slightly larger than the hole in the aluminum ones. So I figured this would make ignition more reliable. Of course the trade-off is they leak powder a little more easily. But, I plan on storing these nose-down and using a block in my ammo pouch to keep them nose down, so that should minimize leakage during use. Some people put a little tape disk over the end of the cartridge and peel it off before use but I'm not going to bother unless it turns out to be a problem.

    I notice that the black tubes are far more rigid than the red Yore tubes. I think this may help with accuracy. With the black tubes, the bullet is held very tightly and rigidly along the axis of the tube. With the Yore tubes, you can easily bend the bullet any which way and you have to pay attention to "set" the bullet straight in the tube. I don't know if this matters or not. I like that the Yore tubes are translucent so you can see the charge and bullet spacing.

    I made up 25 charges with the Yore Tubes in 25, 27, 29, 31, and 33 grains 3F Goex, plus filler, where needed. I made up 25 charges with the black tubes in the same charges, but no filler. Even at 25 grains there wasn't much of a space. 33 grains is the absolute max I could put in with the Eras Gone Smith bullet.

    I'm going to the range tomorrow to give them a go with the new Smith. Hope it shoots good!
    Steve Sheldon
    Commander
    4th Louisiana Delta Rifles
    NRA Certified Muzzleloading Instructor

  7. #47
    J. C. Hall is offline
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    Shot a Smith years ago. Used "Hair Tape" to cover the hole in the back of the tube. Something folks use when setting their hair, comes in a dispenser like scotch tape. It was pink. Anyway, don't have to peel it off, the fire from the percussion cap blows right through it. Never had a problem.

  8. #48
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    Shot a Smith years ago. Used "Hair Tape" to cover the hole in the back of the tube. Something folks use when setting their hair, comes in a dispenser like scotch tape. It was pink. Anyway, don't have to peel it off, the fire from the percussion cap blows right through it. Never had a problem.
    Thanks for the tip!

    There are a lot of "hair tape" products that I found on Amazon, do any of these ring a bell?

    https://www.amazon.com/s?k=hair+tape&ref=nb_sb_noss_1

    When this virus thing goes away I'll have to cruise over the the beauty store and freak out the helpers with my questions again.

    Thanks,
    Steve
    Steve Sheldon
    Commander
    4th Louisiana Delta Rifles
    NRA Certified Muzzleloading Instructor

  9. #49
    J. C. Hall is offline
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    Well, I found that they don't make hair setting tape anymore, but the Nexcare tape https://www.amazon.com/Nexcare-Gentl...r+tape&qid=158 looks like a good alternative. Seems the hairdressers are using it. It is a paper tape. Might be worth a try @ $3 a roll. I shoot a Maynard these days and store and carry my rounds bullet down, although the holes are smaller than those in Smith Tubes and I have noticed no powder loss when reloading them. Let me know how it works if you try it.

  10. #50
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    Thanks, I ordered some!

    Steve
    Steve Sheldon
    Commander
    4th Louisiana Delta Rifles
    NRA Certified Muzzleloading Instructor

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