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Thread: Sharps nm1859 (original) what is correct powder load

  1. #11
    Peter is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eggman View Post
    I'm sure from this you can see that it takes a special person to shoot a Sharps effectively on the line Peter. I'm also sure you're about to have a lot of fun. Regardless of the outcome, know this - you've created a handy dandy little resource on percussion Sharps shooting for the Internet.

    Thank You.

  2. #12
    bobanderson is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter View Post
    The sleeve is frozen in place. The plate on the breech block is free and in good shape.
    Hang on a second, Peter. I'm no expert, but in the original Sharps, the chamber sleeve was designed to float against the breech block so as to create a sort of seal to prevent leakage. Troopers would reset the sleeve to reduce the gas blow by, which can be pretty unpleasant. If your sleeve is frozen in place, you have no idea how large a gap will exist between the sleeve and gas check plate. We have experts in the N-SSA who have engineered a couple of different ways to keep that seal tight and your Sharps safe to shoot.

    I suggest you make contact with Larry Flees (ljflees@hotmail.com or call him at 231-342-0821) and arrange to bring your Sharps to Fort Shenandoah during the Fall Nationals, October 5, 6 & 7. Larry can advise you on the best way to make sure your Sharps is safe enough for those few shots or, I believe, can set it up so you can enjoy it as much as you'd like. If I'm not mistaken, he can do that without ruining the collectibility of your great old Sharps.

    I'll defer to Mr. Holland on this, but I'm almost positive that a frozen sleeve makes for a potentially dangerous gas leak situation.
    Bob Anderson
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    Company C, 1st Michigan Volunteer Infantry
    Small Arms Committee

    "I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a hand on.
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  3. #13
    Peter is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaiderANV View Post
    Better yet Peter......the Fall Potomac Regional Skirmish is this weekend at the Fort in Winchester. I take it you are in Virginny from your post so take a drive and bring the Sharps with you to the Fort. There will be plenty of Sharps shooters there and they will have plenty of ammo with them where you could shoot your Sharps a few times, maybe find out the history of it and then watch the competition. It's pretty addictive! Saturday morning around 8-9am arrival probably best for you to try your hand on the firing line with your gun. At 1:30pm the main range closes to shooting to set up for the team competitions.

    Hello Pat, thanks for the invitation! I wish I could make it but the date is filled for me. I hope to make it up there for the big event in October.

    Peter Chandler

  4. #14
    Peter is offline
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    Thanks Kevin

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Tinny View Post
    Hello, Peter:

    Thank you for your preoccupation with safety.
    May I please share a friendly comment:

    Unfortunately a lot of misinformation exists on the Internet.

    Just for the record and so that our Forum is not somehow tagged/linked with an error, based upon my forty years of collaboration with a PhD explosives chemist who consulted extensively on black powder, neither he nor anyone that he knew has been able to substantiate that traditional black powder can "detonate".

    He was an expert witness in several court cases where detonation was alleged, but never proved.

    Smokeless powders and at least one black powder "substitute", upon which he did extensive research, have been shown to be capable of "detonation".

    Very respectfully,

    Kevin Tinny
    Tammany Rgt, 42 NY, 13667
    That sounds good enough for me Kevin. Thanks very much for the input.

  5. #15
    Peter is offline
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    jOHN hOLLAND

    Quote Originally Posted by john holland View Post
    for this this gentleman who only wants to fire a few shots just to enjoy the experience, i think i would suggest the following:

    First of all, do not worry too much about an "air space" in the chamber as the sharps is a breech loader and an original such as yours most likely will not seal very tight to begin with!

    For loose powder & ball - use a lubricated projectile dropped into the breech, put in a yet to be specified amount of cream of wheat (cow) for filler, then add an appropriate amount of powder. Close the breech, cap the nipple, and fire. Do not reopen the breech once it is closed, prior to firing, as this will introduce unfired powder into the spring recess in the forearm. This condition will cause an explosion in the forearm thereby blowing the forearm or parts thereof off the arm.

    Many competitors have just just pushed the projectile into the breech and added however much powder they wanted with no regard to any filler or air space. It works.

    Preferably, prepare a wrapped cartridge similar to the later model original sharps round. Make a tube with the base flat with a piece of tissue paper or a piece of cigarette paper glued in place at the bottom. Place the powder in the tube, and any necessary filler, then glue or tie the lubed projectile in place. The flame from the cap will burn through the thin paper bottom easily and ignite the cartridge.

    I strongly recommend not using a paper cartridge with a "tail" to be cut off when closing the breech block. Sharps quit using this method early on for the very reason mentioned earlier regarding the forearm.

    Some people here will tell you to buy cardboard tubes, sized to your chamber, from one of our vendors. I don't think the price will warrant the expenditure for the limited number of shots you want to fire.

    I quit shooting a sharps many years ago because it was too labor intensive for me. So, these are just my thoughts, and nothing more!
    john, thanks for this advice. I hope to make it up to the fall finals and will try to look you up. Peter chandler

  6. #16
    mgmradio is offline
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    The boushing ( bushing ) in the breach on original Sharps is not meant to move when firing. It was only to be adjusted by an armorer . The plate in the breach was ment to move forward to seal against the boushing .
    On at least one of the repro's the plate on the breach block is fixed and the bushing moves back against it( or is supposed to ). This didn't work well.

  7. #17
    Peter is offline
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    Kevin Tinney- Thank You!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Tinny View Post
    Hello, Peter:

    Thank you for your preoccupation with safety.
    May I please share a friendly comment:

    Unfortunately a lot of misinformation exists on the Internet.

    Just for the record and so that our Forum is not somehow tagged/linked with an error:

    Based upon my forty years of collaboration with a PhD explosives chemist who consulted extensively on black powder and was at one time Head of The Chemical Engineering Society of The United States (east of the MS River), neither he nor anyone that he knew has been able to substantiate that traditional black powder can "detonate".

    He was an expert witness in several court cases where detonation was alleged, but never proved. "Operator error involving smokeless were the authenticated causes."

    There IS a court accepted laboratory test that proves when smokeless has been used. This test, developed in the 1980's, stopped all the frivolous product liability law suits directed at one maker of modern hunting muzzle loaders!

    Smokeless powders and at least one black powder "substitute", upon which he did extensive research, have been shown to be capable of "detonation".

    Very respectfully,

    Kevin Tinny
    Tammany Rgt, 42 NY, 13667y
    Hello Kevin, Thanks for your comments. I feel reassured with the fact that your friend has a strong science background in gunpowders. Tht helps me make my mind up.

    Peter Chandler

  8. #18
    Kevin Tinny is offline
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    Thanks, Peter:

    Visit us, see how much more there is than our Forum.
    Please consider joining. Finding you a Unit/Team is easy.
    I accepted Lou Ruggerio's kind invitation just over a year ago AND
    progressed via his significant fellowship.

    No regrets. Have met and been selflessly helped by so many.
    It's more about the people. We CARE and pass along lots of helpful ACTION.

    Regards,
    Kevin

  9. #19
    Peter is offline
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    Hello Raider

    Quote Originally Posted by RaiderANV View Post
    Better yet Peter......the Fall Potomac Regional Skirmish is this weekend at the Fort in Winchester. I take it you are in Virginny from your post so take a drive and bring the Sharps with you to the Fort. There will be plenty of Sharps shooters there and they will have plenty of ammo with them where you could shoot your Sharps a few times, maybe find out the history of it and then watch the competition. It's pretty addictive! Saturday morning around 8-9am arrival probably best for you to try your hand on the firing line with your gun. At 1:30pm the main range closes to shooting to set up for the team competitions.

    Thanks for the invitation, but I am committed this weekend. However, I am going to the October Nationals so I may see you there!

    Peter Chandler

  10. #20
    Peter is offline
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    Hello Charlie

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Hahn View Post
    Design Charge is 64 grains of musket powder in a paper or linen cartridge.

    For you limited shooting I would suggest grease ball breech seated with a dowel, 38 grains of loose powder, either 2 or 3 fg. No filler is required and most likely will cause more issues than it solves.

    Here is my cell 410-627-4726 please call to discuss, and I will be at the Fort this weekend. My shop will be open for a while Friday after 3.

    Charlie Hahn

    Charlie thank you for the offer. I hope to call you this weekend. I would like to get up there tomorrow or Sunday, but unfortunately will be helping my daughter move to a new home. However, I am planning to go to the October nationals on the 5th and 6th of October and hope to get some input and then fire my rifle.

    Peter Chandler

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