New 1861 Springfield Rifle Musket Proble

[roundball1]

Fellas, I need your help, badly. I purchased a brand new Pedersoli Springfield Rifle Musket. Dixie recommends a 575 minnie. I have a Lyman 575213 mould. I cast some minies and headed to the range. I lubed the grooves with "old zip", a combination of mutton tallow and beeswax. I seated the rounds on 60 grains of schuetzen 2fg. It was terrible. The rounds tumble down range and strike the paper sideways, if they hit the target at all. I tried some Lyman 577s, but they do not even fit down the bore. What can I do? If I can't get this thing to shoot, I've got an expensive wall hanger.

[Muley Gil]

You want your Minie balls to be about .001" smaller than the bore of your musket.

Have you measured your Minies? And just as important, are you using PURE, SOFT lead? Hard lead Minies won't expand and grip the rifling.

[roundball1]

As far as I know, it is pure lead. I belong to a black powder only club. I dig spent rounds from the dirt berms at the range. I melt it, flux it with paraffin wax while it is molten and clean the impurities from the top.

[Rob FreemanWBR]

Roundball,

Gil is dead on for both accounts - hard lead is the No.1 symptom of "sideways" bullets strikes, aka "key holing".

Would strongly suggest obtaining some pure lead and trying your hand with a batch of rounds using that for your projectiles.

You also mention that you cast & lubed your Minnie’s, but did you "size" them via a sizing die? If so, to what size did you make them?

[roundball1]

No. I don't own a sizing die. I guess I need one. Do they come in different sizes? How do I know which one to get? When I start the 575213 minnies down the bore. they SEEM to go in just right, not tight, not loose, but just enough so that I can feel the grooves of the skirt barely begin to engage the rifling.

[gemmer]

No. I don't own a sizing die. I guess I need one. Do they come in different sizes? How do I know which one to get? When I start the 575213 minnies down the bore. they SEEM to go in just right, not tight, not loose, but just enough so that I can feel the grooves of the skirt barely begin to engage the rifling.


Check out this video. www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWkDPscNyD4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWkDPscNyD4). Good data on your musket.

Duane

[Ron/The Old Reb]

First you need to slug the barrel to fine out exactly what the boar size is. If you do not know anyone who has a set of bore gages. You can do it the way I do it. Take a Minnie that is bigger then the bore and drill a small hole through it from the base to the nose. Then take a small bolt and put it thought the Minne from base to nose and put a nut on it. Then tap it in the muzzle nose first. Grab the bolt with a pair of pliers and pull it out. Mike across the groves to get the bore diameter. You want a Minnie one to two thousands smaller then the bore. You need a sizing die one but no more than two thousandth under bore size. You can get a sizing die from Tom Crone he makes excellent dies.
Tom Crone
6305 Ed Crone Lane
Fredrick MD. 21703
301-473-5699

Also you do not need 60grs. of power to get good accuracy usually 40grs. to 45grs. will shoot nice groups and be sure that your lead is soft.
Have fun.

[Maillemaker]

Depending on the number of lands and grooves in your barrel it can be hard to use standard micrometers to measure the lands/grooves of a slugged piece of lead, because lands and grooves are on opposite sites from each other.

I do not remember the link now, but someone a while back had posted a link to some very inexpensive plug gages in the range we need. Does anyone remember the link?

You don't have to have a sizer for your bullets if your mold drops the right size for you, but for best accuracy you will want to size them.

I use a Lyman Lubrisizer with sizing dies from S&S firearms, but there are cheaper options ( http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/showthread.php/7919-Bullets/page2?highlight=gage )

The Lubrsizer is nice as I can size and lube at the same time.

I tried using the Lyman 575213PH mold with my 2-band Pedersoli Enfield but the mold drops at .575 but the gun needs a .578 bullet.

Like others noted, 60 grains was the full service charge but you may find optimal accuracy at 45-50 grains.

I shoot "whatever" wheel weight lead for my plinking ammo for my modern guns, but I only buy 99.9% pure lead from www.rotometals.com (http://www.rotometals.com) for my muzzle loaders.

EDIT: I book marked it! Here are cheap plug gages:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006JCXK0/ref=biss_dp_t_asn
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006JCXM8/ref=biss_dp_t_asn
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006JCXMI/ref=biss_dp_t_asn
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006JCXOQ/ref=biss_dp_t_asn

Steve

[Eggman]

My vote is with Muley Gil. Lead from the backstop is VERY suspect. Get some pure lead and try again. Start at 35 grains and work up. You are not using enough lube - put a dollip of Crisco in your mini base. If you still get keyholes you may want to consider a thinner base. I use the Lyman 535494 button mini. Forget sizing dyes and sluggers.

[roundball1]

I really appreciate everybody's responses and advise. I have read them and I believe that the propblem is that the lead is not pure and not soft enough. I called the ACE Hardware that is on my way home. They have pure plumbers lead in five-pound packages. I will pick some up on the way home. I will cast some more rounds and get back over to the range hopefully no later than this weekend. I will report back with the results. Thank you again.

[gemmer]

You may want to measure the actual size of those .577 minies. If they came to you as cast there's a pretty good chance that they're oversize.

Duane

[CAGerringer]

Don't bother. I already tried it, and it may be pure "Plumbers" lead, but it is not "pure lead". It's too hard.
Go with Rotometals.

Charlie Gerringer
Old Dominion Dragoons