Unknown "proof" marks on a M1860 Spencer carbine ?

[Jack C., 69th NY]

I recently acquired a Spencer carbine that has at least six 8 petaled flower-like stamps in both the wood and metal. The receiver serial number has been removed and a cryptic marking stamped where the serial number formerly was. I know my Ballards fairly well but know next to nothing about Spencer rifles and carbines.

I attempted to register with the Spencer Shooting Society to ask this question but for some reason I am unable to receive their activation email so I am turning to my brothers and sisters in the N-SSA.

I know that Spencer rifles and/or carbines went to Japan soon after the Civil War and I am thinking that perhaps this might be one of them. However, the Japanese mum had 16 petals while this has only 8.

I know the N-SSA has some quite knowledgeable shooters/collectors and I am hoping someone can shed some light on this Spencer and its markings.

Thanks,
Jack Conway

[jim14th]

I recall reading that Spencers were used in the 1870s by the Kingdom of Siams army , now known as Thailand,and used the petaled flower-like stamp.

[Bruce Cobb 1723V]

I recall reading that Spencers were used in the 1870s by the Kingdom of Siams army , now known as Thailand,and used the petaled flower-like stamp. If yours is already a centerfire, it is most likely a Belgium contracted carbine

[xring2245]

I recently acquired a Spencer carbine that has at least six 8 petaled flower-like stamps in both the wood and metal. The receiver serial number has been removed and a cryptic marking stamped where the serial number formerly was. I know my Ballards fairly well but know next to nothing about Spencer rifles and carbines.

I attempted to register with the Spencer Shooting Society to ask this question but for some reason I am unable to receive their activation email so I am turning to my brothers and sisters in the N-SSA.

I know that Spencer rifles and/or carbines went to Japan soon after the Civil War and I am thinking that perhaps this might be one of them. However, the Japanese mum had 16 petals while this has only 8.

I know the N-SSA has some quite knowledgeable shooters/collectors and I am hoping someone can shed some light on this Spencer and its markings.

Thanks,
Jack Conway

Possibly Belgian

[Jack C., 69th NY]

This Spencer carbine is an original M1860 carbine made by Spencer in Boston Mass. It has not been centerfire converted. I am hoping to find the origin of the 8 leaf flower stamps on the hammer, the block, the receiver, the forearm. There is a cryptic stamping on the receiver where the serial number was before it was removed. The moderator of the Spencer Shooting Society posted several photos that I took of the carbine. Photos can be viewed at http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,50075.0.html (http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,50075.0.html)


I'll keep looking and hoping!

[Rich Foster]

I have the same 8 leaf flower stamped on a M1816 Harpers Ferry behind the tang on the wood only. Never been able to find any
thing about it maybe this will help ring a bell in somebodies brain somewhere. Rich

[hwaugh]

I have a Moore Enfield rifle musket with the same stamping behind the trigger guard.

[olddewey]

I recently acquired a Spencer carbine that has at least six 8 petaled flower-like stamps in both the wood and metal. The receiver serial number has been removed and a cryptic marking stamped where the serial number formerly was. I know my Ballards fairly well but know next to nothing about Spencer rifles and carbines.

I attempted to register with the Spencer Shooting Society to ask this question but for some reason I am unable to receive their activation email so I am turning to my brothers and sisters in the N-SSA.

I know that Spencer rifles and/or carbines went to Japan soon after the Civil War and I am thinking that perhaps this might be one of them. However, the Japanese mum had 16 petals while this has only 8.

I know the N-SSA has some quite knowledgeable shooters/collectors and I am hoping someone can shed some light on this Spencer and its markings.

Thanks,
Jack Conway

Try Dan Stedman from the 14th VA cav Dan did a lot of research on Spencer's and once owned the Spencer belonging to LT Godfrey of the 7th cavalry who was at the Little Big Horn area. Jack Kiley 14th VA 1974-1989

[Eddie Bruner, 12222]

My H&P has the same marking on the stock, and I have owned at least 2 other period muskets with that marking.

-Eddie

[Ron/The Old Reb]

8 petaled flower stamp symbolizes the Lotus flower a sign of Buddhism and Hinduism. Might be a hint of it's origin. India, China, ect.

[Michael Bodner]

Confucius say "Gun no good. Give to Bootsie"

[R Filbert]

The stamp on the carbine reminds me of the flower on a jap7.7 arisaka.

[R. McAuley 3014V]

Unfortunately, there is no method to precisely determine when these marks may have added to the carbine other than to suggest it was sometime over the past 150 years. Although a five or six-pointed asterisk is more frequently encountered today, there is also an eight-pointed asterisk that has been in existence for centuries and is found in not only German runes but in many parts of the world. And too, you can still order steel stamps bearing very similar symbols, and it would not be too terribly expensive to have a steel stamp made with precisely this very same asterisk design.

http://stores.homestead.com/TheUrbanBeader/-strse-552/Basic-Design-Stamp-Set/Detail.bok

http://www.pjtooljewelry.com/impressart-design-stamps.aspx