Can you make an H&P sighted conv SB from an 1816?

[MR. GADGET]

http://www.davide-pedersoli.com/scheda-prodotto.asp/l_en/idpr_71/rifles-1816-harpers-ferry-colt-conversion-harpers-ferry-colt-conversion.html

Have one of these.

So the question is, can you get a Hoyt barrel like a H&P sighted smothbore to use and build a sighted gun and not cut up the real thing.

Thinking about what John said in the S-line about cutting up all the old history.

Would this work for a start as from a little reading Hoyt was doing or rebuilding H&P barrels and they used some 1816 guns for the H&P conversion...

Just thinking about a way to build it as a repop and not screw with a piece of history to build a gun.


Do I need it? NO, Do I want it, Yep just to play with...

[Rich Foster]

A H&P sighted smoothbore was converted from a Flintlock M1816 & M1840. Back then they were destroying original flintlocks to percussion. Then after the war alot were cut down to shotguns again destroying the originality of the gun more. Which made them really parts guns. I take those guns that were butcher with cracked stocks, broken lock parts, rusted out unsafe barrels or shorten barrels, missing barrel bands and rebuild them into a Gun that was used in the Civil War. Who is preserving Civil War guns I wonder. RIch

[Bob Elka, 12001]

The only 1816's that have any historical significance are those rare unaltered weapons still in a flintlock configuration. After getting home from the nationals I began to look into the subject
a bit and though I expanded my knowledge of these weapons I also learned their is scant concrete facts to back up the claims of many. ANY blacksmith or local gunsmith of the times
could have been commissioned to make repairs or alterations to these weapons and unlike other weapons used in the war the smoothbore is a bit of a ghost.

[Bob Elka, 12001]

http://www.davide-pedersoli.com/scheda-prodotto.asp/l_en/idpr_71/rifles-1816-harpers-ferry-colt-conversion-harpers-ferry-colt-conversion.html

Have one of these.

So the question is, can you get a Hoyt barrel like a H&P sighted smothbore to use and build a sighted gun and not cut up the real thing.

Thinking about what John said in the S-line about cutting up all the old history.

Would this work for a start as from a little reading Hoyt was doing or rebuilding H&P barrels and they used some 1816 guns for the H&P conversion...

Just thinking about a way to build it as a repop and not screw with a piece of history to build a gun.


Do I need it? NO, Do I want it, Yep just to play with... Gadget wouldn't it be nice if Pedersoli skipped right to the chase and produced an H&P type weapon and presented it for approoval......

[MR. GADGET]

Gadget wouldn't it be nice if Pedersoli skipped right to the chase and produced an H&P type weapon and presented it for approoval......

Yep it would.....

I would go for a few.

What I'm getting at in this post is two things.
One maybe there is someone that will start building them factory up, or use the 1816 to build from and add what is needed.

That would get a lot more out there to pick from and start shooting if the person wants.

I just looks to me that this is the only gun that we really shoot for comps that there is no Repop.
Just about all the other guns, you can find new as a repop to start shooting.

[Maillemaker]

I have posted a suggestion on the Pedersoli facebook page to consider making an H&P conversion musket.

Steve

[Blair]

Steve,

I too had consider informing Pedersoli on this subject.
However, I also considered asking for members to send me, by e-mail, good photos that I could pass on to Pedersoli for this possibility. Sights included.
I thought I would wait until someone could come up with a definition of a sighted version and a unsighted version of a smooth bore.
Once we get past this sighting question... then we can discuss breaching methods?
My best,
Blair

[Maillemaker]

I sent them a link to a series of photos of an H&P I found on the web:

http://relicman.com/weapons/W1159.htm

Steve

[Blair]

Steve,

That is Good information, thanks.
I have some additional info I can add to this.
I will cross check with Pedersoli to see if it is something they might be interested in doing.
I have to wonder how well it might do here in the US. (Anybody within the N-SSA that wants to add anything, I will pass it on to DP
It may also depend on the European Market that DP will look into as well.
We will just have to wait and see....
My best,
Blair

[Rich Foster]

Blair, You could call Bobby Hoyt and ask him how many H&P barrels he has made since smoothbore was started in N-SSA about 14 or so years ago. That would give you how many people that already have them and how many smoothbore shooters there are. At nationals there are 5 man teams with 117 teams = 585 members competing in smoothbore match. Only somewhat demand for a M1816 H&P sighted smoothbore would be the N-SSA. If Perdsoli M1816 percussion conversion is $1295.00 I would imagine he would convert them H&P by adding breech, hammer and sights. Probably making the gun about $1500.00 or more. There must be some demand because he is producing the M1816. If I converted one of his M1816 to a H&P I would have $1800.00 just in the gun. That is close to $2000.00 once you buy everything to shoot it. Alot of money for a smoothbore when you can convert a cut down or ratted out full stock M1816 for $1000.00-$1200.00 with a custom made barrel. The full stock M1816 H&P I made needed major stock repair,broken lock parts is common. That is why it is so cheap to build one from a ratted out original because nobody wants it. You cannot get out of it what you put into it. Building a H&P is like putting alot of money in a used car you will never get your money out of it just the pleasure of using it. Rich

[nippes]

Couldn't have said it better! 325,000 by Spfld., 350,000 by H.F., 500,000 by all of the contractors.

[Maillemaker]

The Pedersoli folks on facebook said thanks for the info and they would pass it on to the boss.

Steve

[Blair]

He re is an up date on this subject.

Steve, Pedersoli is indeed interested in a new model variation of the 1816/22. He received your info from the facebook site and was very pleased.

Dan Mastin sent me some very nice photos of an original, very good condition, sighted SB 1816/22. I forwarded those on to DP.
I sent Dan a blank SAC speck sheet so he can write up the dimensions for DP to cross check (measurements were the only thing missing from the photos)
My best,
Blair

[Maillemaker]

Awesome legwork, Blair!

Steve

[Blair]

Steve,

Thanks, but I honestly believe it was a simple matter of "good timing" all the way around.

A question I have...This maybe more of a matter for the SAC to address.
There are several variations of bolster styles on H&P conversion. Which style would be the most commonly encountered?
My best,
Blair

[Rich Foster]

Blair, The bolster in relicman's web site photos given under this subject is the bolster that is used. It favors a 1842 bolster with H&P stamped on the side. The other H&P bolster with clean out screw was with a rifled barrel and are not allowed. Rich

[Blair]

Rich,

Thanks. That is what I needed to know.
I will pass that information on to DP.
My best,
Blair

[MR. GADGET]

This is great to hear.
Keep us up to date.

Thanks

[Blair]

Yes Sir,
You can be sure I will try to do that.
My best,
Blair

[Blair]

Just to help do a fallow up, This is a link to DP's facebook site;

https://www.facebook.com/pages/David...179957?fref=ts (wlmailhtml:{95813624-B5F8-487F-9E0F-002742917309}mid://00000045/!x-usc:https://www.facebook.com/pages/David...179957?fref=ts)

For those of you who would like to offer suggestions or put in a bid for something like an H&P sighted smooth bore Musket, this is the place to do it.
Unfortunately you do need to have a Face Book account... and I do not!
My best,

Blair