odd nipple size

[jmiller]

I have a Garibaldi rifle with the cone in barrel conversion, that I can't find the correct nipple for. I have tried 5/16x18 and it is too lose in the threads. I checked the thread pitch with my guage, and get 16tpi. The diameter of the threads is .318 with my caliper. I have tried a pottsdam nipple, and it is way too large.
Anyone have any ideas? I have tried several sutlers with no luck.
Thanks,
Joe

[Don Dixon]

Joe,

When you say "cone in barrel," I assume that you are talking about the conversions made by brazing a lump of metal on the breach of the barrel and then drilling and taping it for a nipple seat.

The Austrians did not convert to the metric system until 1870, and the conversion did not become effective for the Army until 1871. The System Werndel rifles were the first Austrian Army weapons made to metric standards. The earlier arms, to include the Muster 1842/44 and M 1849 Kammerbusche ("Garibaldi" rifles in the states, although Garibaldi's troops don't appear to have carried them), were made to derivations of Schritt; an Austrian military pace based measurement that corresponds to neither feet nor meters. One Schritt is 29.5 inches.

Most of the Kammerbusche were converted from System Augustin tubelock to caplock in Liege, Belgium, before being exported to the States. The Belgians were on the metric system. When I have been able to pull a nipple from one of the Liege conversions, the threads have all been metric. There are several different sizes of nipple threads based upon which Liege shop did the conversion. The most common that I have seen is 8mX1.25. I would suggest that you try that for a start. It is almost certain that an American inch based threaded nipple will not fit your rifle.

Regards,
Don Dixon
2881V

[jmiller]

yes, I was talking about the brazed lump method of conversion. I was wondering if it was metric, and will now start looking in that direction. Thanks for the help, as this nipple has really been a pain to figure out!

Joe

[jmiller]

I just tried an 8x1.25 nipple in it, and the diameter was great, but thread pitch was off. Do they make a 8x1.5, or an 8x1.75 nipple?

[Don Dixon]

Joe,

I suspect that that nipple screws in almost all the way, leaving just a little of the nipple base proud of the nipple seat. First, make sure that the threads in the nipple seat are as clean of powder fouling and corrosion as you can get them. Then apply a LITTLE force to the greased 8MX1.25 nipple with a nipple wrench. See if that works. With the exception of London Armory and her Majesty's arms factory at Enfield Lock, everyone in Europe was still working with a combination of machine and hand technology at the time of the Civil War. Consequently, things are often just a little off spec and not fully interchangeable.

If that doesn't work, try House of Muskets, Pagosa Springs, CO. They also operate TRESCO, LTD, the supplier of the bronze colored AMPCO nipples sold by some of the sutlers. I have seen AMPCO nipples in Europe that are not covered in their U.S. catalog (i.e., Schritt threaded nipples for the M1851 Swiss Federal rifle). They may have some 8MX____ threaded AMPCO nipples that they supply to European vendors that they don't normally list in the U.S. due to small demand.

Regards,
Don

[jmiller]

When I tried to install it, I cleaned the female threads to bare metal. The nipple threads in about 2 threads worth and then binds up. I applied some force toit, and no go:( I will contact House of Muskets, and see what they have. Thanks for your help, at least I know where to start looking.
Joe

[Richard Hill]

Mine takes a nipple for an original Smith carbine, as do most of the Belgian-converted firearms I have. The fit is a tad on the loose side, but if the female threads are in good condition this won't be a problem.

[jmiller]

I tried house of muskets with no luck. I may have to dril land tap to a different size, or have a machinist make me one:(

[R Filbert]

Call Dan Whitacre He makes odd size nipples for me from time to time- He has an assortment of thread guages and the like and may be able to help as I had the same rifle- Dont rely on a loose fit nipple as you could shoot yer self in the fore head- Be careful. and be safe.