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EPPS1919
02-10-2013, 08:59 PM
I started working on the Union Repeating Gun/ Ager Gun/ Coffee Mill Gun. This gun was used by the union troops in the Civil War, Lincoln nicknamed it the Coffee Mill Gun. A friend of mine works at the museum at Quantico Marine Base and has one in their collection that they let me take pictures of and take measurements off us as much as I could without taking the gun apart. I got a lot of basic measurements and pictures. I am going to post some pictures of the original gun and some of the stuff I have already done. Dr. Gatling stole the idea for the chambers from this gun and the carrier too for this gun back in 1862 to build his first Gatling, and was sued in court over it. This gun was invented in the 1850\\\\\\\'s, and is a close relative of a Gatling, and I thought it was pretty cool. It used the same chambers as my 1862 Gatling, which is one of the reasons I wanted to build it so I could use the same chambers as I have.

EPPS1919
02-10-2013, 09:21 PM
Cutting the carrier

John Holland
02-11-2013, 12:21 AM
Fascinating, please continue!

John Holland

Maillemaker
02-11-2013, 12:50 AM
You built an 1862 Gatling?

I test CAD software for a living. As a test subject, I am modeling an 1862 Gatling using the original patent drawings.

Do you know of any surviving 1862 style with the separate chambers instead of cartridges?

How did you design yours?

I'd love to hear more about your Gatling.

Steve

RaiderANV
02-11-2013, 07:31 AM
I sold and original mint Auger barrel to a team member a few years back. He has no plans for it. Just bought it when I was selling a ton of junk. If you need a barrel I'll put you in touch with him.

Tom Magno, 9269V
02-11-2013, 10:50 AM
I believe that the New Market Battlefield museum at New Market, VA has a coffee mill gun - albeit it is in dug up condition.

EPPS1919
02-11-2013, 07:33 PM
You built an 1862 Gatling?

I test CAD software for a living. As a test subject, I am modeling an 1862 Gatling using the original patent drawings.

Do you know of any surviving 1862 style with the separate chambers instead of cartridges?

How did you design yours?

I'd love to hear more about your Gatling.

SteveHello, yes I built it a couple of years ago, it is not an exact copy but real close, I used the patent drawings to make the parts. My gun uses separate chambers just like the original and that is what this coffee mill gun will use, the only difference is I use shot gun primers instead of musket caps. You can click on the link to see some of my built of the gatling gun here. http://www.gatlinggunforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=55.

EPPS1919
02-11-2013, 07:41 PM
I sold and original mint Auger barrel to a team member a few years back. He has no plans for it. Just bought it when I was selling a ton of junk. If you need a barrel I'll put you in touch with him. I wish I would have known that before I already bought a green mountain barrel. If he wants to sell it at a decent price, I might be still interested. I will have to check out the New Market museum to see that gun.

EPPS1919
02-11-2013, 08:12 PM
The original gun had a one piece cast receiver, and I am making mine out of plate steel and I am going to bolt it together and once I get it all working I am going to weld it all together to make it look like one piece cast. This is some pictures of the receiver I am building.

Mike McDaniel
02-11-2013, 08:50 PM
You do realize that once you get this going, people will want to buy copies? :)

EPPS1919
02-11-2013, 08:58 PM
You do realize that once you get this going, people will want to buy copies? :) I'm going to see how it go's, this is the proto type.

EPPS1919
02-11-2013, 09:31 PM
One pix of the original gun and making of the lifter.

Maillemaker
02-11-2013, 11:58 PM
Awesome pictures and videos of the Gatling!

Inspires me to get to work modeling it. I'll have to pay someone to machine the parts though.

Steve

Ron/The Old Reb
02-12-2013, 08:24 AM
http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1399&stc=1&d=1360674332A number of years ago someone built a Coffee Mill Gun and brought it to the fort. Here are some pictures of it.
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EPPS1919
02-12-2013, 07:22 PM
That's Cool, it has an extened hooper on it. the one i got pix of dos'nt have the extenion

EPPS1919
02-13-2013, 09:27 PM
The wedge and making the cam and cam follower. The first pic is of the alinement rod, dummy barrel and the detent ball on spring steel to hold the carrier in place when firing




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EPPS1919
02-14-2013, 09:28 PM
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M.Zandarski 5973V
02-16-2013, 11:46 PM
If you would like to get some input about building a Coffee Mill Gun contact Brian Haack, haackfamily@msn.com (\"http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/\"http://\\\\"http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/\\\\\\\'http://\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"mailto:haackfamily@ms n.com\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"\\\\\ \\\\\\\\\\'\\\\"\\\"\") . He went down to Westpoint and worked with the curator there. They did a \\\"cleaning\\\" of the gun they have there and he took pictures, made sketches, and took dimensions. Check out youtube, http://youtu.be/P767jNWeryM (\"http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/\"http://\\\\"http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/\\\\\\\'http://\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"http://youtu.be/P767jNWeryM\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ "\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'\\\\"\\\"\") ,Union Repeating Gun - Brian Haack

EPPS1919
02-17-2013, 10:17 AM
I am sending an e-mail to Mr. Haack now. Thanks for the information and I hear he built a Williams gun which I want to make my next project! PS the youtube link wont work.

M.Zandarski 5973V
02-17-2013, 11:09 PM
Look up the Youtube video under Union Repeating Gun - Brian Haack
Brian is starting a second Williams Gun. Some of our other projects were 4-Ellsworth Rifles, and 2-Hughs Guns. On a smaller scale we are working on 3 reproductions of a civil war sniper rifle made by LeFever and Ellis and 3 Merrill conversions of the 1841 Misssissippi and 1 Merrill conversion of a 1842 Springfield Rifled Musket.

EPPS1919
02-18-2013, 06:49 PM
I talked to Brian Haack today for a long time. He was a great guy with a lot of information on this gun and I learned a lot that I did not know about the gun, he said to call him anytime if I had any questions, etc. Thanks a lot for the contact information! Dave

EPPS1919
02-20-2013, 08:23 PM
Reaming barrel support, the dummy barrel for alinement for the support and the gusset for the support.

EPPS1919
02-20-2013, 09:47 PM
Turning and threading the Green mountain barrel to fit the support.

EPPS1919
02-23-2013, 08:05 PM
1434143514361437Receiver all welded up,still need to clean up the welds and barrel fitted to the gun. installed the crank hubs

EPPS1919
03-01-2013, 09:04 PM
Making the crank handle, milling the key way in the shaft and the finished crank, handle,shaft and cap screw.

EPPS1919
03-11-2013, 08:36 PM
Making the shield using 3/8 plate and 1/2" plate for the support. Cutting the site slot and making the rivits from 3/8" carriage bolts.

EPPS1919
03-11-2013, 09:34 PM
The finished shield and a light coat of flat black paint

Michael Bodner
03-13-2013, 12:51 PM
You sir, have genuine talent...

Now, make seven more and we can field a team for a new event !!

And THANKS for sharing this with us. Can't wait to see finished product and hear her roar....

-Mike

EPPS1919
03-13-2013, 07:15 PM
You sir, have genuine talent...

Now, make seven more and we can field a team for a new event !!

And THANKS for sharing this with us. Can't wait to see finished product and hear her roar....

-Mike That would be an awesome event!

EPPS1919
03-25-2013, 09:51 PM
I made three hammer springs before I got it right! Had to order .093 spring flat steel. The .063 was not strong enough, now it fires the primers every time! :)
Here are some pics of the original and my gun. Still need to make the hopper and almost ready to test fire. Got the timing all up to snuff, that took awhile!!

EPPS1919
03-25-2013, 10:08 PM
more pics154915501551

EPPS1919
03-26-2013, 07:22 PM
Here's a video of how the gun works The Civil War Coffee Mill Gun - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DG-M7u-jwok)


http://www.n-ssa.org/vbforum/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif

EPPS1919
03-26-2013, 08:12 PM
A card board mock up of the hopper. I will start to make the hopper out of brass next. no more then 20 rds in Mary-land15561555

EPPS1919
04-02-2013, 08:18 PM
Making the hopper, all the parts are made from brass. cut all the parts out and silvered the main parts toghter. going to soft solder the trim on next and a lot of cleaning up and polishing.

EPPS1919
04-02-2013, 08:30 PM
Dose it look like the original in the pic next to it? Now i need to make the Agitator that go's in the hopper. That's what the square hole in the bottom is for. It has a 1/4" square rod that pushes up on a plate to agitate the chamber to keep form binding up.

EPPS1919
04-02-2013, 08:37 PM
One more pic

EPPS1919
04-04-2013, 07:58 PM
The last pic of the original has a piece of brass on the right that has a square hole in it, is not right. some body must have put that in there years a go. it should have a agitator plate in the bottom.

EPPS1919
04-15-2013, 06:43 PM
Some pic's of the Agitator in stalled it's a hinged plate that goes up and down to keep the cartridges from binding up. It has an arm that rides on top of the wedge that moves the plate up and down. 163716381639

Ron/The Old Reb
04-16-2013, 08:47 AM
MAN! I wish I had your talent.

Michael Bodner
04-16-2013, 02:58 PM
Out-Freakin'-standing!! PLEAZZZZZZE tell us that you intend to bring it to Spring Nationals and display it?

-Mike

EPPS1919
04-16-2013, 08:17 PM
[Out-Freakin'-standing!! PLEAZZZZZZE tell us that you intend to bring it to Spring Nationals and display it?] I'd would like to wait and finish it first, test fire and make a carriage for it. maybe i can shoot some clays with it to.

Michael Bodner
04-17-2013, 12:43 PM
Just to be able to see/tough it would be good enough for most of us!

-Mike

kjh123
05-14-2013, 08:44 PM
Im not quite as far as you but I am getting there. Your Ager looks good....Hope mine turns out just as well, I am in the process of getting spring right but all the major parts are finished.

EPPS1919
05-21-2013, 09:15 PM
Im not quite as far as you but I am getting there. Your Ager looks good....Hope mine turns out just as well, I am in the process of getting spring right but all the major parts are finished. Awesome, somebody ells is building one I would like to see some Pix's of your gun and do you have any Pix's of the base plate or swivel plate that looks like a fish tale. The gun i looked at did not have a swivel plate.

EPPS1919
08-05-2013, 08:01 AM
Cuting, facing off,drilling, reaming and counter sinking the 209 primer pockets . All made for 1" round stock. This is for making the chambers or cartridges.

EPPS1919
08-11-2013, 09:41 AM
The barrel on the original gun was 1.25" mine is 1", so i got a 1.25" od and 1"id piece of DOM. tubing to make as a sleeve. turned off the flats to 1" and JB Welded the sleeve over the barrel. Then i welded up the muzzle and turned the muzzle on the lathe so you can not see the seem. added the front site

EPPS1919
08-11-2013, 09:57 AM
Cut the flat for the rear site and dove tailed the front site in. The front site truned out to be to short, I had to weld an extention to the front site to make it tall enough. I bore sited the gun at 25 yards so hopefully it will shoot close to the point of aim. I think I am ready for a test fire!

EPPS1919
08-11-2013, 10:17 AM
200620072008Made the swivel pin 1.625 dia.X 3" long. welded it on and painted the gun OD. green. the original gun I looked at had been painted black some time ago. Were the paint had chips in it you can see green paint.

EPPS1919
08-11-2013, 10:40 AM
Ok, Here is a video of the first test fire, It went reel Good!!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mw9UFaxpkRA

Jim Barber
08-11-2013, 10:16 PM
Awesome! Any idea how it grouped shots?

Cheers!
Jim B.

EPPS1919
08-12-2013, 08:11 PM
2009The target on the left was the 5 shot group and on the right is the 25 shot group in the test fire video at 50 yrd's with the gun bouncing between shot.

Maillemaker
08-12-2013, 09:03 PM
Awesome! Amazing accuracy!

Steve

Jim Barber
08-12-2013, 09:09 PM
Outstanding! Sure can see how it walked between shots. Very nice, and looking at that, I bet you can get hella good repeatability once it's on a carriage.

Hope you can bring it to Nationals for a demo!

Okay, no one else will say it, so I will: we want more video!

Best,
Jim B.
Grove City, OH

Michael Bodner
08-13-2013, 12:38 PM
Oh BABY!!! Thanks SO MUCH for sharing this project on-line with the folks. I thoroughly enjoyed the you-tube video of you live-firing. You should be darn proud of yourself and your talents!!

Looking forward to seeing it in person (hint, hint, hint). I'm sure we can arrange for a live-fire demo during any Nationals that you want!!

Thanks again for sharing!

-Mike

kjh123
08-17-2013, 10:42 PM
Several years ago my friend and I decided we were going to build a coffee mill gun. So I did some research and emailed everyone I could find. I was the guy who ended up going down to Quantico to measure up the original ager. I was able to take it apart, measure and Trace all the original parts just incase I forgot a measurement or 2. I also tooks a ton of pictures and video of the various parts. After the quantico visit I drew up the gun in solid works to make sure it all worked in 3d space. After that I made a version out of wood to test the mechanics as well as printing a few parts on my 3d printer. Everything worked out as planned and the gun is almost 100% true to the original. Progress is slow I only get a little time here and there to work with my friend on our project. We are now working on the spring pressure to fire the percussion caps for a .57 cal. We are also working on replica carriage, which in it self is quite the project. I have attached some pictures of our build.20262022202320242025

Michael Bodner
08-19-2013, 12:10 PM
Even the wooden mock-up looks nice!

How about making a boat-load of these guns in wood for us mere mortals to play with!!

-Mike

EPPS1919
08-19-2013, 07:26 PM
Several years ago my friend and I decided we were going to build a coffee mill gun. So I did some research and emailed everyone I could find. I was the guy who ended up going down to Quantico to measure up the original ager. I was able to take it apart, measure and Trace all the original parts just incase I forgot a measurement or 2. I also tooks a ton of pictures and video of the various parts. After the quantico visit I drew up the gun in solid works to make sure it all worked in 3d space. After that I made a version out of wood to test the mechanics as well as printing a few parts on my 3d printer. Everything worked out as planned and the gun is almost 100% true to the original. Progress is slow I only get a little time here and there to work with my friend on our project. We are now working on the spring pressure to fire the percussion caps for a .57 cal. We are also working on replica carriage, which in it self is quite the project. I have attached some pictures of our build.20262022202320242025Wow, your gun looks great! I got measurements and pictures of the same gun at Quantico, but they would not let me take it apart. I wish I could have, it sure would have made it a lot easier to build. I wish I had C&C and Cad equipment, that sure makes it nice. I am just a hobbyist, learning as I go! Dave

Maillemaker
08-19-2013, 09:53 PM
You know, if you've got it modeled up in CAD, you could upload it to GrabCad and anyone could make one...

Steve

kjh123
08-29-2013, 04:56 PM
But during the build there have been several changes......to make the parts fit exactly.....over all frame is ok but some of the internals have been adjusted to operate smoothly. I really haven't been updating my cad files. I don't want to put anything up there and get people hollering at me because it all doesn't fit perfectly. Maybe at a later date I can update all the drawings.

EPPS1919
08-30-2013, 08:54 PM
Here is an article about the Coffee Mill Guns. Scroll down it is the 7th story.

http://www.forgottenweapons.com/

EPPS1919
08-31-2013, 08:19 PM
Another good one http://www.historynet.com/civil-war-guns

EPPS1919
09-25-2013, 09:57 PM
I went to the New market VA. battlefield museum and got some pix of a coffee mill gun they have. It's hard to get good pix through a plexiglass box. And one of a model some body made.

kjh123
12-14-2013, 11:55 PM
Started out with 8" Bar stock and machined the hubs. Glad I live in amish country and got some help with the spokes and fellows. It is nice to know some one who has made them in the past. (included picture of Wheels.)

Made the frame and axle block from oak from the local saw mill. Metal bits were formed from material from local metal shop, I machined my parts to fit.

Square bolts and carriage parts purchased on line except for the 3/4" bolts I made, cheaper and easier.

57" Wheels and carriage, as close to an original as possible, from original prints.

My son has helped me out as well as my friend who you may see in some of my pictures. :)230523072303

kjh123
12-23-2013, 01:16 AM
I have most of the parts now, this is the mock up of the gun and carriage.23132312
Trying to figure out the spacing and height for the gun mount.

EPPS1919
12-26-2013, 08:01 PM
Kjh, That looks great. I just got the swivel plate done for the gun. now need to start on the carriage.23222323232423252326

EPPS1919
12-26-2013, 09:19 PM
Forgot to ad the wood mock up.

EPPS1919
02-13-2014, 08:42 PM
Working on the 42" wheels. Made a full size drawing of the wheel and some templates of the parts.turned the hubs from 8x8 blocks. 239123922393

EPPS1919
02-14-2014, 08:45 PM
Making the fellows and spokes

EPPS1919
02-14-2014, 09:13 PM
Spokes and banding the hubs

EPPS1919
02-15-2014, 06:43 AM
Making the Axle out of 1.5" angel iron welded together to make square tube. welded in 1.375" round stock for the axles and cut it in the middle bent it and welded it up so it will have 2 degrees of camber at the wheels. Banded the ends of the wood.

Ron/The Old Reb
02-15-2014, 08:48 AM
Beautiful, beautiful work man do I wish I had your talent.

EPPS1919
03-16-2014, 02:31 PM
Rolling rings for the hubs and laminating white oak boards to make the trail and cheeks.

EPPS1919
03-16-2014, 02:37 PM
More trail pix.

kjh123
03-17-2014, 08:21 PM
Haven't had as much time as i would have liked to work on my gun. Only thing that I have gotten done is priming the carriage and grind down the main gun frame. Working sucks id rather be tinkering.

Looks like you got a great start on your wheels....cant wait to see them finished...we took different approaches to the wheels and carriage but both will look awesome in the end......

What color of paint do you think is the color for the gun? and the carriage?

Gloss or flat for the gun?
What color green for the cartage?
Gloss or flat for all the metal parts?

Any how happy building.......

EPPS1919
03-18-2014, 08:19 PM
This is 2 pix of a original carriage and a reproduction. I want mine to look like them and I am going to paint the gun and carriage olive drab and semi gloss black for the metal parts

John_Michael
07-22-2014, 09:54 AM
I started working on the Union Repeating Gun/ Ager Gun/ Coffee Mill Gun. This gun was used by the union troops in the Civil War, Lincoln nicknamed it the Coffee Mill Gun. A friend of mine works at the museum at Quantico Marine Base and has one in their collection that they let me take pictures of and take measurements off us as much as I could without taking the gun apart. I got a lot of basic measurements and pictures. I am going to post some pictures of the original gun and some of the stuff I have already done. Dr. Gatling stole the idea for the chambers from this gun and the carrier too for this gun back in 1862 to build his first Gatling, and was sued in court over it. This gun was invented in the 1850\\\\\\\'s, and is a close relative of a Gatling, and I thought it was pretty cool. It used the same chambers as my 1862 Gatling, which is one of the reasons I wanted to build it so I could use the same chambers as I have.


Is that the museum you are referring to?

Sincerely,

John Michael
"Preserving the memories so others will remember..." ™

EPPS1919
07-23-2014, 08:30 PM
National Museum of the Marine Corps? I think that's what its called.

Bruce A 7th Va
07-29-2014, 03:41 PM
The museum he is speaking of is The National Museum of the Marine Corps.

kjh123
10-29-2015, 09:36 PM
Adding Some Paint to the Ager - Will upload pictures of finished carriage

36023603

kjh123
08-11-2016, 05:30 PM
https://youtu.be/Md9EpzTyh7c

Sine the video has been shot the carriage has been finished and is ready to mate to the gun.

4482

EPPS1919
08-12-2016, 08:55 PM
your gun and carriage look Great but your tiller handle is a little off it needs to be bent out a little just passed the gun and it should tapper down to the end and be rounded on the end. An E-Z fix here is some pix of mine. [ Pix not working . Will post later.]

EPPS1919
08-13-2016, 08:50 PM
The tiller

EPPS1919
08-13-2016, 09:05 PM
some more of the wheel and carriage. I need to find the time to finish this project. http://www.n-ssa.net/vbforum/images/icons/icon7.png

kjh123
08-17-2016, 08:47 PM
Also, I bought a brass plating kit and am going to try to plate some of the parts, to mimic the original.

Your gun is looking good as well you are just about there, I think the carriage took as much time to build as the gun itself.

Now that this gun is mostly done and I have to tinker at the range I'm going to start on 1862 gatling gun or something that uses the same cartridges as the ager. First I need a set of good prints than can go from there. Anyone know where I can get a set? I plan on drawing it up in solidworks.

Maillemaker
08-18-2016, 02:25 PM
I pulled down the original patent drawing for the 1862 Gatling from the US Patent Office.

Steve

Maillemaker
08-18-2016, 02:29 PM
Here are the original 1862 patent drawings/text:

http://imgur.com/a/1OhOl

Steve

C.W. Artillery
08-28-2016, 06:59 AM
REPLICA OF THE "COFFEE MILL GUN"

28 August 2016

Mr. EPPS 1919, I send accolades for your demonstrated initiative, industry, skill and most of all your intelligence. You are one very smart individual, without question, if you don't mind me saying so. I do hope to see first hand your version of the Coffee Mill Gun (C.M.G.) in the near future. Perhaps as soon as the coming Fall Nationals (2016) at the Fort. More importantly, I look forward to meeting you in person and having the opportunity to speak with you about the C.M.G. adventure that you were on.

If you wouldn't mind, may I ask you about two aspects of the C.M.G., comparing your project, versus the original C.W. era version? My current understanding is that the C.W. version's "chamber pieces" (cartridges) all used threaded musket style nipples (cones) with musket size percussion caps in place prior to loading them into the hopper (magazine). QUESTION -- Did the single spring loaded hammer strike the nipple and thus cause ignition, or rather, did the hammer strike an intermediary transfer bar or block which in turn struck the nipple/s?

I also understand that your version of the C.M.G. used "chamber pieces" (cartridges) which accept modern primers, either large rifle or 409 size. QUESTION -- Does your hammer have a firing pin attached to the face of the hammer similar to that of the Colt S.A.A. revolver ? If not, is your hammer design have a flat face which in turn strikes a "floating" firing pin with a coiled return spring or some similar device.

Thanking you in advance for your help with my effort to learn more about your magnificent project.

With my best regards,

Webb Brown
First Maine H.A. (retired)

C.W. Artillery
08-28-2016, 07:22 AM
REPLICA OF THE COFFEE MILL GUN


28 August 2016

TO: John Michael

FROM: Webb Brown

Mr. Michael, I read with much interest your post which indicates that during the C.W. period in U.S. history, Doctor Gatling was involved in litigation with another party (parties), presumably concerning the ownership of the mechanism design features. Would you happen to know the case citation and/or dates and court where the litigation was brought? I would assume that the litigation was heard in the U.S. District Court in Washington, D.C., but not necessarily.

I would be happy to report on that litigation in the N-SSA Forum in the future.

Webb Brown
First Maine H.A. - Retired

.

EPPS1919
08-30-2016, 08:47 PM
Hello, my gun is almost an exact replica of the original that I got the measurements off of, except for the chambers which use shot gun 209 primers. As you said the original used musket nipples with caps. Mine does have a firing pin made into the end of the hammer. The original had a flat face hammer that would strike the caps. The original would strike the caps directly, no inter-mitten block. My gun uses chamber pieces just like the original, but with 209 primers. I found the primers to be much more reliable. I used a modified shot gun re-loader, (Mac 600) to load my chambers which I also used in my 1862 Gatling Gun that I made several years ago. It is not to original specs, but works like the original. I will be at the fall Nat's working with the Artillery crew assisting the Artillery Officer. My Name is Dave with the 13th confederate Inf. Looking forward to meeting you.45804581

Maillemaker
08-30-2016, 10:51 PM
Hi Dave,

Where are there any surviving 1862 style Gatlings? I would love to see an original. I did not know any survived!

Steve

EPPS1919
08-31-2016, 05:12 AM
Hi Dave,

Where are there any surviving 1862 style Gatlings? I would love to see an original. I did not know any survived!

Steve

I know that West Point museum in Ny has one. It sits next to the coffee mill gun


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

C.W. Artillery
08-31-2016, 07:29 AM
31 August 2016



Hello, my gun is almost an exact replica of the original that I got the measurements off of, except for the chamber My Name is Dave Eppley with the 13th confederate Inf. Looking forward to meeting you.


Good morning Dave --- Thanks very much for your above message and for the additional photos, one of which appears to have been taken at Fort Ross. I know you will be busy at the Fall National with lots going on, so if you have some time, I would very much like to meet you and perhaps see your Coffee Mill Gun in person.

I will keep in touch with you as we get closer to October.

Thank you kindly,

Webb Brown

.

C.W. Artillery
09-02-2016, 07:54 PM
02 September 2016


Hello Dave--- I know you probably will already know this about the Agar machine gun , a.k.a. The Coffee Mill Gun. but thought I would pass it on for others who have an interest in your work, the same as I have.

At the time of President Lincoln's view of the test trials of the Agar Machine Gun, he was seriously impressed with the guns performance. Immediately thereafter, Lincoln " suggested " that the War Department award a purchase order for ten (10) copies of the gun. Not long after the guns were received and placed in action, the U.S. War Department placed a follow up order for an additional fifty-four (54) copies of the gun.


Regards,

Webb Brown

kjh123
09-03-2016, 08:07 PM
Hi,

I have been wondering where the fall nationals are being held? I live near Akron Ohio and was wondering if it was realistic for me to go. I only have the weekends due to my job where I am off during the summer, spring break, x-mas break and federal holidays. I'd be interested in seeing the guns and possibly bringing my Ager down to shoot.

Thanks,,

Kirby

C.W. Artillery
09-04-2016, 08:27 AM
04 September 2016


Hi,

I have been wondering where the fall nationals are being held? I live near Akron Ohio and was wondering if it was realistic for me to go. I only have the weekends due to my job where I am off during the summer, spring break, x-mas break and federal holidays. I'd be interested in seeing the guns and possibly bringing my Ager down to shoot.

Thanks,,

Kirby

Good morning Kirby ---

Thanks for your interest in attending the 2016 N-SSA "Fall National Shoot" and activities. The N-SSA property in physically located approximately five miles due West of the City of WINCHESTER, VIRGINIA if you were coming from the North or South using Interstate highway I- 81.

Let us know if that is doable for you this year.

Regards,

Webb Brown

First Maine H.A. (retired)

.

C.W. Artillery
09-04-2016, 08:34 AM
04 September 2016

Hi again Kirby ---

Happy Labor Day holiday to you. I was interested in asking you if we might have you post a few photos of your Agar machine gun together with some information about its origin. Would it perhaps be an original or a reproduction copy ?

I hope someone will be coming along later in the day with membership information so that you will consider joining and participating in future N-SSA events.

I did a Google Map inquire for time and distance estimates for travel between Akron, Ohio to Winchester, Virginia and the results indicate that such a trip would cover a distance of just under 300 miles in a period of approximately 5 hours. Not bad at all !

Regards

Webb Brown

C.W. Artillery
09-05-2016, 11:54 AM
--- AMERICAN CIVIL WAR AGAR MACHINE GUN ---


05 SEPTEMBER 2016

The initial U.S. Government purchase of ten (10) Agar machine guns at the behest of President Lincoln was made at the purchase price of $1,500.00 per copy, for a total procurement of costing Fifteen Thousand Dollars. I have no information at this time as to what sum the U.S. Government paid for the follow on contract for the additional copies of the Agar gun.


Hope you all have a safe and happy Labor Day holiday.

Webb Brown
First Maine H. A. (retired)

.

C.W. Artillery
09-06-2016, 06:39 AM
Hi,

I'd be interested in seeing the guns and possibly bringing my Ager down to shoot.

Thanks,,

Kirby

Mr. Kirby -- As I'm sure you understand, the North-South Skirmish Association is a membership organization with extensive safety rules and procedures in connection with their shooting competitions. I am a past member and at the present time, a visiting guest of the N-SSA, just as you are.

Should you wish to join the N-SSA and wish to compete in future matches, may I suggest that you communicate with JOHN HOLLAND
expressing those desires. Mr. Hollard can point you in the right direction and speak to the issue of safety and which arms and artillery would be allowed in competition.


Webb Brown

First Maine H.A. (Retired)

.

kjh123
09-17-2016, 08:12 PM
Well my interest started just as soon as I finished building an RG&G gatling gun replica. I wanted to see if I could make something unique and full size. After a lot of research I had narrowed my next build down to the "Ager" and the Gardner. I chose the ager because it was the rarer of the 2. There were no prints out there and just a few examples so I figured Id have to find a museum that had one in their inventory and talk them into letting me take measurements and create patterns off the original. I got lucky when I contacted the National Museum or the Marine Corps., they had one....It wasn't on display but they had one in their archives, which happens to be located in a nondescript building in the Marine Corps. Base Quantico. The curator at this installation was nice enough to disassemble the gun for cleaning at which time I took detailed measurements as well as tracing parts such as the hammer, Hammer Cam, Base Plate, Spring etc. I spent around 8 hours there getting all the information I could before I had to leave. I then took all the measurements I had and created 3D CAD Models. I took those cad models and created a wooden prototype to test fit and function after that I went to metal and built the gun. The only difference between my gun and the original are the materials that were used. I chose to use steel instead of brass because I had a lot of it lying around and the brass would have cost a small fortune. The gun I created is an exact replica of the original that I measured up, I'm sure that there are variations on the design but every part on the original is Identical to the one I built. The gun carriage on the other hand is a bit different. Didn't really know what carriage was use for the gun but figured the military used what ever they had around. The gun carriage that I built was just scaled up from the RG&G gatling gun model. I figured why not it, was period correct, and I could use it as a base for different guns that I may build in the future. Just like the Ager, I built the carriage from scratch, literally made every part with the exception of a few Lag bolts.

Right now it sits in my basement, behind the couch and next to the tread mill, as a show piece;). The gun is as close to original as I could make it from the information that I had. The gun is .58 Cal black powder, uses cap and MiniBall in a steel tube (Shell). Don't know much about black powder but am learning. As of right now I have shot a lot of wax bullets to test the function of the gun, it works well, next .58 Cal mini ball. Kind nervous about it because I know nothing about black powder.

Enjoy the pictures.......If you would like to see any specific parts let me know and I will get close up of them. Also if you look earlier in the post you can see build photos....46444645464646474648464946504651

C.W. Artillery
09-18-2016, 05:15 PM
BUILDING THE CUFFEE MIIL GUN



Thanks for your recent post in connection to your great project that you have so willing shared with us. If you would have the time, could you speak to the barrel of the gun. I hope I am correct in concluding the barrel in rifled. I would not be at all surprised to learn that you performed the rifling process as well as the remainder of the "build" work.

If you also did the rifling process, did you work from data taken from the original gov't contract gun while you were at the base in Quantico?

Thanks much,

Webb B.

kjh123
09-18-2016, 06:01 PM
Hi,

I did not do any of the Rifling, I went to the World Renowned "Log Cabin Shop" in Lodi, Ohio and bought a barrel from them. Since they build historically accurate rifles I just went to them for help. They set me up with a rifled barrel that was period correct and caliber correct. They are the experts I am just fooling around trying to build things.

I took the barrel and machined it down to match the original. The only thing that I did not do was add a front sight.

EPPS1919
11-15-2016, 08:03 PM
4807480848094810OK I started work on the gun again. Made the gun mounts this weekend. I welded 1" heavy wall tubing to the 1' x 2" plate, milled it and lots of grinding to get it to look like it was cast iron pieces.

kjh123
11-17-2016, 08:14 PM
Looking good you should have it finished up soon.....

EPPS1919
12-17-2016, 09:35 AM
Thanks Kjh123, yours looks great. I'm Making progress slowly on mine.

EPPS1919
12-17-2016, 10:05 AM
Making the trail plate and lunette. I used 3/16" x3" plate and bent it using the torch and a big piece of pipe to bend a smooth curve for the trail plate and lunette. I made the ring out of 1/2" round stock by heating it with the torch and wrapping it around a 2" pipe piece then cut and welded a 1/2" x 1" plate to it. I then clamped it all to gather and drilled the holes for the bolts. It came out pretty nice.:)

EPPS1919
12-17-2016, 10:14 AM
Making the trail handles out of 1/2" round stock. I heated them with the torch and bent them in the vice, then I heated the ends like a Blacksmith and pounded them with a hammer to get the flat end for the bolts to go through.

EPPS1919
12-19-2016, 08:48 PM
Making the elevating screw and wheel handle. Wheel handle is made from an old bronze gear. I saved the gears from the trash years ago. I had to make a bushing for the handle and pressed it in. The screw I bought it's 1-1/8'' and the big nut. used a ball end mill on the turn table to make the nice profile and drilled the holes in the handle. I also made the axle clamps and tie down loop. Now to make the elevating screw plate. I also painted the carriage OD green like an original would be. all the Pix. ended up in the reverse order, can't fix it, sorry.

kjh123
12-25-2016, 10:01 AM
Looks Really good. Nice work, like the pictures.

EPPS1919
05-13-2017, 07:22 AM
Made the ammo boxes for carriage out of pine and painted OD green with brass hinges. Had to order slotted wood screws none of the local hardware stores sell them only Phillips head
Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204969&stc=1&d=1494599059 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204970&stc=1&d=1494599219 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204971&stc=1&d=1494599295 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204972&stc=1&d=1494599377

EPPS1919
05-13-2017, 07:33 AM
https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204973&stc=1&d=1494599469 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204974&stc=1&d=1494599589 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204975&stc=1&d=1494599655

EPPS1919
05-13-2017, 07:39 AM
Made a table to make the wheels on. Cut out the center and fixed a short axle to hold the hub in the center and so I can use a locking collier to adjust the hub height for the dish in the wheel.
Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204985&stc=1&d=1494606277 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204986&stc=1&d=1494606368 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204987&stc=1&d=1494606410 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204988&stc=1&d=1494606475

EPPS1919
05-13-2017, 07:41 AM
Jigs for cutting the angels on the spoke ends.

Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204993&stc=1&d=1494607129 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204994&stc=1&d=1494607188 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204995&stc=1&d=1494607311 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204996&stc=1&d=1494607407

EPPS1919
05-13-2017, 07:43 AM
Had to turn the hubs in the lathe for the spokes. the spokes are so close together at the hub I just cut out the center and going to use shims/ wages with epoxy in the hubs between the spokes. Had to do some fine triming on the fellows with the jig set up to get them to fit just right. What a PITA that was.

Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204997&stc=1&d=1494607995 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204998&stc=1&d=1494608107 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=204999&stc=1&d=1494608192 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=205000&stc=1&d=1494608322

EPPS1919
06-01-2017, 02:19 PM
the wheels will have the 3/8" x 2" hot rolled steel tire installed next also made the hitch pins for the wheels out of 3/8 round stock and 1"x 1/2" steel
Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206059&stc=1&d=1496164230 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206060&stc=1&d=1496164274 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206061&stc=1&d=1496164324

EPPS1919
06-01-2017, 02:22 PM
https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206063&stc=1&d=1496164439 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206064&stc=1&d=1496164494 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206066&stc=1&d=1496164788

EPPS1919
06-01-2017, 02:25 PM
A friend of mine how owns Southern Md Arc Welding has this Bad ass roller.The roller can roll 3/4" plate steel. Well he rolled the tires for me. thanks Cook off

Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206068&stc=1&d=1496165064 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206069&stc=1&d=1496165264 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206070&stc=1&d=1496165321

EPPS1919
06-01-2017, 08:48 PM
Wrapped the tire around the wheel and clamped it in place to find were I need to cut it a 1/2" short so it will shrink fit on the wheel. cut a V shape and filled in the V with weld then cleaned up the weld
Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206071&stc=1&d=1496165999 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206072&stc=1&d=1496166053 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206073&stc=1&d=1496166094

EPPS1919
06-01-2017, 08:52 PM
Heated up the tire with a ROSE BUD tip in tell it was real hot. Hot enough to just scorch the wood but not red hot. that expanded it enough so that can be beat down around the wheel and when it cools it shrinks on tite. one tire went on eazy the other one I had to beat the crap out of it to get on but it came out nice.[ like my safety shoes? https://www.mdshooters.com/images/smilies/lol.gif and I did pick up the hose off the rim and held it off wile heating.]

Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206075&stc=1&d=1496167098 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206077&stc=1&d=1496167149

EPPS1919
06-09-2017, 08:23 AM
IT'S DONE finally after 3 years of on and off working on it.https://www.mdshooters.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206201&stc=1&d=1496339686 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206202&stc=1&d=1496339743 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206203&stc=1&d=1496339825

EPPS1919
06-09-2017, 08:38 AM
https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206204&stc=1&d=1496339888 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206206&stc=1&d=1496339925 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=206207&stc=1&d=1496339988

RaiderANV
06-09-2017, 09:18 AM
Amazing job!

EPPS1919
06-09-2017, 10:56 AM
Amazing job!

Thanks Raider now I need to enter it in the Artillery match [emoji106]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Michael Bodner
06-09-2017, 11:41 AM
I've been tracking this build for the last couple of years - PLEASE bring it to Fall Nationals and display it !!!!!!!!

If space is available, I'm sure we can get the Board of Directors to allot a display area on Sutler's row (by the creek) for you to put up a pop-up and display the gun with a sign, etc....

BTW: Awesome job - I'm always envious of real craftsmanship...

And of course, the $64 question is: What's your NEXT project?? LOL

Thanks again for sharing with us!

-Mike

EPPS1919
06-09-2017, 06:12 PM
I've been tracking this build for the last couple of years - PLEASE bring it to Fall Nationals and display it !!!!!!!!

If space is available, I'm sure we can get the Board of Directors to allot a display area on Sutler's row (by the creek) for you to put up a pop-up and display the gun with a sign, etc....

BTW: Awesome job - I'm always envious of real craftsmanship...

And of course, the $64 question is: What's your NEXT project?? LOL

Thanks again for sharing with us!

-Mike

I think we can do that if you find a way to arrange it thanks Bootsy. And the $64 answer is [The Williams Gun] a confederate breach loading canon.:D

CAGerringer
06-10-2017, 08:04 PM
I'm with Bootsie. That is 'eye-watering' craftsmanship! And...I want to see it. And... I want to meet the man that can recreate the pinnacle of Civil War technology in his garage!
Charlie Gerringer
Old Dominion Dragoons

Mike McDaniel
06-10-2017, 08:45 PM
I'll add my voice to the chorus. And a quality video of the gun would not be amiss...I think we can help.

EPPS1919
06-11-2017, 08:57 PM
Thanks everybody I will be at a friends to shoot it next weekend and try to make a good video and post it here.:)

EPPS1919
06-18-2017, 09:01 PM
Got to shot it at my friends place for the first time on the carriage and work great. The door for the chambers to fall in kept bouncing closed from the chamber hitting it.I will work on that.https://www.mdshooters.com/images/smilies/party29.gif https://youtu.be/gcsviX3clZU

EPPS1919
06-18-2017, 09:25 PM
Here's a pic of what it did at 25 yard's I would have liked to shot it at 50 and 100 yard's but the ravine was full of stickers. I need to adjust the front site a little left. but it is shooting pretty close.

Lou Lou Lou
06-19-2017, 07:51 AM
Outstanding group

Ron The Old Reb
06-19-2017, 09:08 AM
Have you kept track of how many hours you have put into building it?

EPPS1919
06-19-2017, 09:46 AM
Have you kept track of how many hours you have put into building it?

No I don't but it's a lot


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EPPS1919
07-20-2017, 05:54 PM
Got to shoot the Gatling and the Coffee Mill Saturday at 50 yard's. The paper target is the Coffee Mill gun and the Freon can is both guns. Did a nice job on the can .https://www.mdshooters.com/images/smilies/lol.gif can not get the pix right side up

Attached Images https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=208925&stc=1&d=1499707944 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=208926&stc=1&d=1499707984 https://www.mdshooters.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=208927&stc=1&d=1499708001