Errant Mississippi - Do I Need to Glass Bed?

[oscarlovel]

I just bought a beautiful Euroarms Mississippi in 54 cal to shoot Rounball matches with. Took it to the range yesterday and started trying to determine an accurate load. No luck with any load shooting .530 RB, pillow ticking patch with wad between powder and patch and Swiss 3F powder from 50-85 grains. Best I could manage at 50 yards off the bench was 1 1/2" (3 shot group) and that was not repeatable. This rifle has not been glass bedded. Both barrel bands are loose. I'm thinking they should be tighter to obtain any sustainable accuracy and my guess is I need to go ahead and glass bed, but would appreciate some input here. BTW, previous owner said he could never get it to shoot with Minies either.

[Ron/The Old Reb]

I would glass bed it. It can only make it better. I have all my muskets glass beded.

[Maillemaker]

What happens if you glass bed it and find out the barrel is junk? Can you drop in a replacement barrel and re-bed on top of the existing bedding? How close a fit to the OEM barrels are replacement ones?

Steve

[Gary Van Kauwenbergh, 101]

Is your tang screw tight?

[oscarlovel]

Barrel does not appear to be junk. Worst case on that score would be I'd send it off to Bobby Hoyt and have the barrel relined. But the rifling looks sharp and no sign of pitting, rust, etc. No tight areas when seating the patched round ball. The tang screw is tight, but my thinking is the bedding may be poor.

[jonk]

I just dealt with this with an errant euroarms 2 band enfield. I took it by Bobby Hoyt's shack at nationals, and he determined the rifling was awfully shallow. He's going to deepen it for me and we'll see. If it has 1:48 twist by chance and 3 groove rifling, it's probably the same type of cutter used on both guns. By all means bed it; it DID help me a bit, but not enough, but it's something to consider if that doesn't fix it.

[oscarlovel]

I just dealt with this with an errant euroarms 2 band enfield. I took it by Bobby Hoyt's shack at nationals, and he determined the rifling was awfully shallow. He's going to deepen it for me and we'll see. If it has 1:48 twist by chance and 3 groove rifling, it's probably the same type of cutter used on both guns. By all means bed it; it DID help me a bit, but not enough, but it's something to consider if that doesn't fix it.

Not the same rifling as yours. This is a 1-66 twist I believe and 7 grooves and lands with 0.007 rifling, if DGW is to be believed. Trust me, if after it is bedded, it still doesn't shoot, then off to Bobby it goes for his magic.

[Ron/The Old Reb]

Did you check the crown. I have a Zouave that the crown was bad and it shot all over the place. Had it recrown and it tighten right up. But if you have Bobby Hoyt reline it, you won't be sorry.

[oscarlovel]

Pulled the barrel this morning and did a real close inspection of the factory bedding. To begin with, the barrel inlet forward of the aft barrel band is oversized, riding against the left side of the barrel with a significant gap to the right. The ramrod spring that is supposed to be pinned in place is AWOL, though the pin is still present. The front lock screw is exposed and the barrel apparently rides upon it. Likewise, the aft lock screw is also exposed and it would appear that the breechplug may ride against it. I temporarily shimmed underneath both of the barrel bands and in the breech area with business card stock. It tightened up the barrel in the stock noticably when I reinstalled the barrel. IMHO, I have no choice but to glass bed this rifle as these metal to metal contacts, combined with a loose fit in the stock to begin with is a recipe for real inaccuracy. FWIW, I noticed that the JRA Zouave I have also has the front lock screw exposed in the barrel channel and the barrel actually is worn where they contact. Would appreciate any input form you guys. Am I making a mountain out of a mole hill?

[Rich Foster]

Your Mississippi barrel is thick enough to relieve from the barrel to allow for it not to lay on lock screws. If you have loose bands a neat trick to do before glass embedding is put relief agent under barrel under nose band area and under barrel in breech lug area. Then put a quarter size dab of 5 minute epoxy in stock under upper band and breech lug area. Then place your barrel in stock, slide your bands on and then place tang screw in and tighten till tang moves down then back it off so it does not push tang down. Shoulder your gun look down the sights to make sure the sights and barrel are not canted. If it is you have time to turn the barrel to straighten up sights. Once that is done 5 mintes later your barrel is set. freshen up rest of inlet of stock and do your glass bedding job. Rich

[oscarlovel]

Well, went to the range today and was completely frustrated. I had glassbedded the Mississippi last week and was expecting to get a tight group. Tried PRB loads ranging from 40-75 grains of 3F with both .015 and .020 patches. No luck and the rifle is impossible to even sight, as it shoots some 10" left at 50 yards and no amount of sight correction seems to be enough. I had one shot that hit exactly to point of aim and that was the second shot of the day. After that it was a crap shoot. This was off a concrete bench with sandbag rests, and I usually have a very good group with my 1903 Springfield, Swiss K-31 or my AR15, I took another look at the crown, but I see no nicks. i dropped a penlight down the bore, and re-examined rifling. It is VERY shallow. Slipping the tip of my little finger inside the bore and twisting it, I can barely discern any rifling. It looks to me like Euroarms cut the rifling too shallow and after a shot or two, no matter swabbing the bore, and no matter the patching, I appear to be skipping the rifling and wind up with a smoothbore. It was like I had never glass-bedded.

It looks to me like it is decision time. I can send the barrel to Bob Hoyt and get it relined back in .54 caliber with deeper rifling for roundball shooting, or send it to Dan Whitacre to be rebarreled in .58 caliber. I've owned Whitacre's barrels before and they were great for Minies. Not sure how they would do for roundball, and have not heard from anyone much about their experiences doing so. Suggestions?

[matt]

Shallow rifling would be better for minnies. Deep for patched round ball. There really is no compromise on depth its one or the other. So if its going to primarily a prb shooter than go deep if not try it with some minnies and see how it does.
Matt
Winslow's Battery 1st NY Lt Artillery 9775v

[oscarlovel]

Sending the barrel off to Bob Hoyt for a reline back to .54 cal for Roundball.

[Southron Sr.]

Do a full length GLASS BEDDING JOB. This is the ONLY WAY TO SALVAGE your stock.

Don't worry about the missing ramrod spoon. I ALWAYS take the ramrod spoon out and throw it away when I am doing a full length glass bedding job; I don't think having the rear of the spoon bearing on the underside of the barrel does any good in the accuracy department.

Also, be sure to glass bed your barrel's tang.

Whoever glass beds your stock is going to have to know what they are doing to keep bedding compound from migrating into your ramrod channel, lock & lock mortice, etc.

THE GOOD NEWS IS: A decent full length glass bedding job will cure all your accuracy problems with your Mississippi.

[oscarlovel]

Do a full length GLASS BEDDING JOB. This is the ONLY WAY TO SALVAGE your stock.

Don't worry about the missing ramrod spoon. I ALWAYS take the ramrod spoon out and throw it away when I am doing a full length glass bedding job; I don't think having the rear of the spoon bearing on the underside of the barrel does any good in the accuracy department.

Also, be sure to glass bed your barrel's tang.

Whoever glass beds your stock is going to have to know what they are doing to keep bedding compound from migrating into your ramrod channel, lock & lock mortice, etc.

THE GOOD NEWS IS: A decent full length glass bedding job will cure all your accuracy problems with your Mississippi.

Appreciate your input, and having read your previous (and excellent posts) on glass-bedding I did do a full length glass-bedding with particular attention to the tang area. Alas, the rifle still won't group trying multiple loads, powders, etc. I'm sending it to Bobby Hoyt to be relined. Thanks, though.