Wadcutter & Whitney

[Buck]

I own one of James River Armory's Whitney Rifle Model 1855. It has a rate of twist of 1:60. With the RCBS Hodgdon it is a tack driver.

At the last skirmish I attended, I saw some shooters using the wadcutter with great results. It looked like shooting a pop gun and there was hardly any recoil.

I was wondering if anyone has ever shot a wadcutter with a Whitney rifle. How did it work? And what kind of powder and powder charge was used?

Thanks for any replies, advice, and pointers.

[Dan Greketis 4914V]

A wadcutter will group very well but is way to wind sensitive for me. I use Rapines international with a one hole group and it is very wind resistant. 50 grains FFF.

[Southron Sr.]

A Heartwarming and TRUE story of the Days of Yore:

There was a well known shooter that purchased a Lyman mould that turned out those little 315 grain "Wadcutters." He found that if he loaded his cartridges with 28 grains of FFFg powder and that little Wadcutter-he never missed at 50 yards.

The members of his team were so impressed with the little Wadcutter, they all purchased their own Wadcutter moulds and shortly, the whole team was winning every Musket Team Match they attended.

They grew boastful and arrogant. Every time that they would show up at a Skirmish, other teams would tremble and realize that there was NO way they could win against the "Wadcutter Wildcats" (a nick name given to them by the other teams.)

But like the Good Book says: "Pride cometh before the Fall," and sure enough one day the Wadcutter Wildcats showed up at a Skirmish. The other teams trembled as the Wildcats walked to the firing line with the sure knowledge that "Victory" would soon belong to the Wadcutter Wildcats.

Unfortunately, it was the day that a weather front was passing thru the area. The winds were brisk, choppy and came from many directions. Shooting in those windy conditions-the "Wadcutter Wildcats" ran the full time on the Pigeon Board and left 3/4's of the clays undamaged!

What strange magic is this they asked themselves? Truly, they thought, a hostile Wizard had unleashed some bad fortune opon them. Unfortunately, the rest of the Skirmish was the same. It was truly an "Ill Wind" that blew because they finished LAST in the Musket Team Match that day!

They drove home from the Skirmish with downcast hearts and tears in their eyes. Their Fall had been hard. So ended the saga of the "Wadcutter Wildcats" and their days of Skirmish Glory! Suddenly, there was a surplus of used Lyman Wad Cutter moulds listed "For Sale" in the classified ads of their hometown newspapers.

All were "sadder but wiser."

[matt]

Funny story, but can see where you can get comfortable with something that works in perfect conditions. But what will work in no wind on a sunny hot day may not work on a cold rainy windy day. So do you choose a heavy bullet that will buck the wind but gives increased recoil? Or do you shoot the same bullet in all conditions and learn where it goes? Maybe the answer is a middle weight bullet ? I shoot the RCBS minnie and at 100 yds if the wind is blowing have to really change my point of aim.
Matt

[DAVE FRANCE]

Dear Southron,

I loved your story. I have related a similar story on this BB before that describes what happened to a musket team that was in first place in the standings for the musket competition until the wind picked up and they had to shoot their wadcutters at 100 yards. I won't repeat my story because your version is better and the lesson is clear.

David

[Greg Ogdan, 11444]

I must say that I find it interesting that we seem to think that we must shoot the same bullet and load for all events. I don't shoot a wadcutter at 50, but I do shoot a lighter bullet than the big minnie which I use for 100 yds. I admit, it does coomplicate things, but I really don't like recoil and my 50 yd load shoots really well and cheaper than the long range load. Am I nuts, or are there others that shoot 2 different loads also? (Yeah, I know I opened myself up with that last comment!)

[DAVE FRANCE]

Greg,

When I started in the N-SSA I used wadcutters, and they shot very well at 50 yards. I soon found, they did not shoot as well at 100 yards. Their light weight and high drag design made them unacceptable for 100 yards.

I read some NRA published articles that said that wadcutters and semi-wadcutters usually shoot well in pistols at 50 FEET, but not at 50 yards. I also found that larger Minies (around 500 grains) would shoot much better at 100 yards than the wadcutters.

About 15 years ago I met someone who is a ballistic engineer for the Army. I asked if there is any advantage to a bullet with a shoulder. He said no as I knew he would.

Some people shoot a lighter weight Minie that has a good aerodynamic design. For years I have used a 450 grain Mine with a good aerodynamic design. It is very much like an Original Minie or the International bullet. It has a very small shoulder. I think that is a good compromise.

A lot of people like a bullet that weighs about 450 grains but has a shoulder. I don't know why.

THE FOLLOWING IS A RELATED, BUT NOT THE SAME SUBJECT AS ABOVE

People are funny about wadcutters. A friend of mine used to shoot a bullet with a shoulder (like a semi-wadcutter) in his Sharps carbine. He asked me if I had any idea why it doesn't shoot well. I told him the shoulder was catching in the chamber or throat causing the bullet to cant in the barrel and proabalby be damaged slightly. He changed to an origianal style bullet and they worked well.

I shoot lever rifles a lot. I have seen at least six magazine articles that mentioned don't use wad cutters in lever rifles, they may not feed well if the shoulder catches in the chamber or the throat of the barrel. And if that happens it won't shoot well.

If you look at adds for bullet molds for rifle and pistol molds, the wadcutters are listed under pistol molds except for Minie bullets.

David

[Buck]

I shot the wadcutter sized at the diameter .001"more than they are normally sized with other minies. Then shot them with 35 grains of 3F. At 50 yards they were accurate - straight on. But they were stiff when pushing them down the barrel - couldn't use them in a skirmish. So I sized them at the diameter that I normally size other minies and shot them with 35 grains of 3F. This time the rounds went all over the place. So I sized them again the usual diameter and shot them with 30 grains. Again they were hitting all over the place on the target - not as wild as with 35 grains but still too big of a group.

I have given up on the wadcutter. I'll use the RCBS Hodgdon with one of those base plugs you can buy that makes a bigger cavity and reduces the weight of the Hodgdon to around 355 grains. I'll test that and see how it goes.

Thanks for the posts,
Buck