Help with an artillery carbine

[Ashland Grays]

I found what I believe is an original Enfield style artillery carbine. The lockplate is marked Tower 1862. There is a very faint marking on the stock with the word Hunt or Hurt ? No sign of a BSAT cartouche.
Rear sight is the long range type generally found on the longer pattern Enfields. The original type of rammer has been replaces with a button rammer and it has the side type bayonet lug.

What have I found ? Is $300.00 a good price ? It actually appears shootable to me.

Thanks.

[ken chrestman]

Could be a Potts & Hunt, lock should be markes as such no Tower and barrel marked P & H on the underside. I have seen 2 and 3 bands, my two is a bar on band while the 3 band is a trpical P-53 configuration, both with LR sight. Could also be a parts gun as well, sounds priced to sell.

Ken Chrestman, 7147V Tennessee

[Ashland Grays]

I went back and looked at the carbine and noticed the word or name DEAN stamped in the ramrod channel ? Thoughts anyone ?

[Southron Sr.]

Nnn-interchangable Enfields (those NOT made at the Enfield Lock Armory OR The London Armory Company) were made by the "cottage industry" system, i.e., One individual or small firm would specialize in making locks, another barrels or ramrods or whatever.

The final step of "manufacturing" a non-interchangable Enfield was when all the parts were acquired by the stocker and he made the stock and finished the arm. The name "Dean" in the ramrod channel is the stocker that made the stock and finished the arm.

[R. McAuley 3014V]

Nnn-interchangable Enfields (those NOT made at the Enfield Lock Armory OR The London Armory Company) were made by the "cottage industry" system, i.e., One individual or small firm would specialize in making locks, another barrels or ramrods or whatever.

The final step of "manufacturing" a non-interchangable Enfield was when all the parts were acquired by the stocker and he made the stock and finished the arm. The name "Dean" in the ramrod channel is the stocker that made the stock and finished the arm.

From "On the Progress of the Small Arms Manufacture," by J. D. Goodman in Journal of the Statistical Society of London, Vol. 28, No. 4 (Dec 1865), p494-506 [Read before Section F, British Association, At Birmingham, September 1865.]


...The manufacture of the various parts of the gun, as barrel, lock, &c, are distinct trades. These several parts are collected by the manufacturer, known as the gunmaker, and by him are set up. The chief branches are as follows:— Stock making, barrel making, lock making, furniture making, oddwork making; and for military guns there are in addition, bayonet making, sight making, rammer making.

The stocks are of two kinds— beechwood and walnut. They are brought to Birmingham, cut from the plank into the form of the gun. Beech stocks are grown in this country, chiefly from Gloucestershire and Herefordshire. Walnut stocks are, with few exceptions, imported from Italy and Germany. One Birmingham contractor, to meet the demand occasioned by the Crimean war, established saw mills in Turin, and since that period has converted into gun stocks nearly 100,000 walnut trees. He has left but few sound walnut trees standing in the district in which he carried on his operations. The greater part of the supply was obtained in Piedmont, and smaller quantities from Ferrara, Bologna, and Modena. An average size tree yields about thirty gun stocks; those cut from the heart of the tree are most valued, and are used for first-class military arms and the best sporting guns. About one stock in five or six can be obtained “all heart;” the remainder are “sap and heart” and “sap.”

Barrel making is quite a distinct trade. For the manufacture of military barrels a somewhat larger plant of rolling, boring, and grinding machinery is required. No barrels are made in England, except in Birmingham and its immediate neighbourhood. The invention of making gun barrels by means of grooved rolls is due to a Birmingham manufacturer of the name of Osborne. It was on the occasion of a strike of the barrel welders that he was led to make the experiment. He was not allowed to introduce his system without opposition, for no sooner were his rolls set to work, than twelve hundred barrel welders, each armed with his forge hammer, proceeded to the private residence of Mr. Osborne, in the Stratford Road, threatening its destruction. The military were called out before the disturbance could be quelled, and for many days afterwards a guard was placed over the mill in which the work was carried on.

Gun locks are made in Birmingham, and, on a still larger scale, in the neighbouring towns of Darlaston and Wednesbury. Furniture, under which head are included the heel-plate, trigger-guard, &c., is made either of brass for military guns, or cast iron for common sporting guns, or forged iron for the better qualities. The odd work, consisting of screws, pins, swivels, &c, is produced in Birmingham by manufacturers, who make also sundry implements connected with the trade, such as turnscrews, nipple keys, lock vices, &c. The bayonets required for the military trade, form an important branch: they are made in Birmingham and West Bromwich. The sword bayonet, which has been largely adopted, is generally produced by the same manufacturers. Scabbard making is a distinct branch; scabbards are of two kinds, steel and leather.

On reference to the directory of the present year, we find 599 names of manufacturers engaged in the different branches of the trade. Of these 174 are gun makers. Of the remainder the greater number are makers of distinct parts of the gun. Others again are workmen, such as stockers, finishers, engravers, &c. These are of the class who are out-workers, employing a few assistants, and work at the same time for different masters.

Gunmaking, or “setting up,” is again very much subdivided. It is only in the more important establishments that all the branches are carried on on the premises of the gunmaker. More or less, out-workers are engaged in every branch. This system makes it extremely difficult to obtain a correct estimate of the number of workmen employed in the trade. Probably no master can tell how many hands he is employing at any given time, and the number varies from month to month with the demand. About ten years ago an endeavour was made to ascertain the number of hands engaged, and as the workmen themselves assisted in the inquiry, it was at the time, no doubt, a tolerably correct estimate. The number is less than at the present time, and probably it does not represent more than half the number called into requisition by the American demand during the war. With trifling exceptions women are employed only in one branch, that of “making off,” or giving the final sand-papering and polish to the stocks, a light and not unsuitable employment. A few women are employed in polishing and barrel-boring. It is difficult to say why such work has fallen into their hands, as it is both dirty and laborious.

The list of workmen employed estimates the total number at 7,340. Of these 3,420 are engaged in producing the materials, the barrel employing 700, the lock 1,200, the bayonet 500 and so on.

Setting up these materials into guns employs 3,920 men. Of these the three chief branches are the stockers, screwers, and finishers. Each of these branches, with its sub-branches, is estimated to employ 1,000 men. The stocker lets the barrel and lock into the stock, and roughly shapes the stock. The screwer lets in the furniture and remaining parts of the gun, and further shapes the stocks. The finisher takes the gun to pieces, and distributes the several parts to the browner of the barrel, the polisher, the engraver, &c., &c., and when they are returned he puts the gun together, and finally adjusts the several parts.

The out-working system leads to the employment of a considerable number of young boys, who are employed mainly in carrying the work from one to another as it passes through its several stages. No very correct estimate can be given of the rate of wages earned by the workmen of the gun trade. With very few exceptions the work is paid for by the piece, and the rate varies considerably with the demand. During the past ten years there is little doubt but that the wages earned in this trade have probably exceeded those in any other. Several branches require very high skill, and the remuneration is in proportion; for instance, barrel-boring and settling, stocking, rifling, lock-filing, &c. A judgment can be formed of the delicacy of workmanship required in the first of these branches, when I state that a military barrel has to be bored with such truth that it must receive a plug measuring 577 thousands of an inch, and is condemned as useless if it take one of 580. A workman in this branch, in full employment, has frequently been known to earn his 5l. to 6l. a-week.

It is a very common practice in many of the branches for a workman to employ several assistants, whether working in the factory of his employer or as an out-worker; such men, while paying those under them at the rate of 5s. to 10s. for boys, and 15s. to 25s. to adults per week, will take for their own share several pounds. A workman is held to be an inferior hand who, in any of the skilled branches cannot earn, single-handed, 30s. per week. It is admitted that in many cases the high wages confer little benefit— the money is frequently wasted, and bad habits encouraged; but, on the other hand, many are known to have saved money. Workmen in this trade will be found enrolled in one of other of the freehold land societies of this town, and living in houses of their own. The recent bank failure in Birmingham discovered savings which were little known before. In one case a finisher who had steadily remained in the employment of one master for twenty-five years, was found to have no less than 800l. lying in the bank. ...