.36 Cal and .44 load data?

[noonanda]

With Nationals a week away Im prepping my stuff and I am going to shoot individuals for Pistol for the first time. What do people use for loads, and do most use roundball or conical. This is the one area where I waited until the end to prep for and its gonna be kind of rushed. I do plan on testing my loads prior to, just trying to get a feel for good baselines.

I have bot an 1851 Navy(.36 Cal) and an 1860 Army(.44 Cal)

[Eggman]

Round ball only. The bullet shaped thing will only hit the side of a barn on a good day. .451 for the .44. Crisco from cake decorator in each chamber for lube. Keep loads very light - heavier the load the wilder you'll shoot. Use filler if you need to. I've never heard of anyone using a .36 on the line. Try to find a guy named Norm to shoot along side. Guaranteed medal.

[marv762]

in my 36 cal i use 21 grains of 3f goex shoots great! you can shoot less with filler to take up the space.

[Dheisey#7003]

I have only ever shot my 1851 at one regional, with dismal results. I have big hands so it never held well for me. HOWEVER, I have shot it at SASS shoots with 18 gr 3F, I do not remember the amount of cream of wheat, but it was enough so I could seat the .376 RB in the cylinder. I use crisco in cooler weather, MCM lube in hotter weather. It will hit steel.

[noonanda]

Thanks to everyone who gave me input. I figured out 20Gr of 3F GOEX will hit where I want vertically using a 6 o'clock hold. I was not using cream of wheat but I think I will. Im going to figure out how much I need to use tonight after work to get the roundball to sit just under the edge of the cylinder.

[Maillemaker]

As with any gun, you'll want to do a load workup, but generally speaking, most .36 guns do well around 12 grains of 3F and most standard .44s do will around 18 grains 3F.

Now the big iron like Walkers and Dragoons will need a lot more. My Walker like 45 grains 3F.

I have found filler to give better results than no filler.

Steve

[Mike McDaniel]

I hate to break it to the OP, but the top-tier shooters use solid-frame revolvers. My own Hege-Remington? 15 grains of Swiss 3f. .457 ball. Cream of Wheat filler, a dab of lube on top.

[noonanda]

I hate to break it to the OP, but the top-tier shooters use solid-frame revolvers. My own Hege-Remington? 15 grains of Swiss 3f. .457 ball. Cream of Wheat filler, a dab of lube on top.

Its my first year being able to shoot Nationals, and I already own these two guns. Im not in it to win all kinds of medals, Im here to have fun and if I win cool beans, if not hey I wasnt at work.

[noonanda]

As with any gun, you'll want to do a load workup, but generally speaking, most .36 guns do well around 12 grains of 3F and most standard .44s do will around 18 grains 3F.

Now the big iron like Walkers and Dragoons will need a lot more. My Walker like 45 grains 3F.

I have found filler to give better results than no filler.

Steve

Steve do these have taller front sights because I started out at 15Gr 3f Goex with a 6 oclock hold and was about 6 inches high fron the top of the bullseye I was shooting at. Same problem with the 1860, it was shooting high using 22 Grains

[Maillemaker]

Hi Daryl,

Just about all of my BP revolvers shot 7" or so high at 25 yards. Nature of the beast. My only exception was my Pietta 1851 Navy that shoots point of aim at 25 yards.

I usually replace the front sight.

Also don't let them discourage you on your Colts. While I agree the solid-frame revolvers are generally superior a Colt can get the job done. This one is bone-stock except for the taller front sight.

https://i.imgur.com/Jj8gpTVl.jpg

[hobbler]

With Nationals a week away Im prepping my stuff and I am going to shoot individuals for Pistol for the first time. What do people use for loads, and do most use roundball or conical. This is the one area where I waited until the end to prep for and its gonna be kind of rushed. I do plan on testing my loads prior to, just trying to get a feel for good baselines.

I have bot an 1851 Navy(.36 Cal) and an 1860 Army(.44 Cal)

With long bullets maintaining their alignment and the base staying perpendicular to the bore take forethought, design and care in execution. The round balls are self aligning and the round backsides take care of the bases needing to be perpendicular. So people shoot round ball because it works. If something worked better they'd be using it.

[Maillemaker]

If something worked better they'd be using it.

And indeed, a lot of people are.

Steve

[Eggman]

And indeed, a lot of people are.

Steve
Numbers please.

[Eggman]

With long bullets maintaining their alignment and the base staying perpendicular to the bore take forethought, design and care in execution. The round balls are self aligning and the round backsides take care of the bases needing to be perpendicular. So people shoot round ball because it works. If something worked better they'd be using it.
Another factor not addressed here is bullet weight. Revolvers' biggy issue is coping with recoil. The more weight you push forward the more recoil to cope with. Thus the low powder charges, and, the lighter weight round ball, plus, ball contact/friction with the inside of the barrel much less with round ball.

[Maillemaker]

Numbers please.

I know the Moose "Collar Button" bullet is quite popular with a lot of N-SSA shooters.

At least 4 people on my team shoot it. And I know other people outside our region shoot it. Ian Egbert is a fan.

Steve

[Gary Vikar]

Here the thread on the Moose collar bullet. posted in 2015, https://www.n-ssa.net/vbforum/showthread.php/10918-REVOLVER-mould-now-available-from-Moose-Moulds?

[noonanda]

Here the thread on the Moose collar bullet. posted in 2015, https://www.n-ssa.net/vbforum/showthread.php/10918-REVOLVER-mould-now-available-from-Moose-Moulds?

Thanks, looks like an interesting bullet

[TCLewis]

I know I am late to the party since it is November but here is my experience.

I have been able to get most revolvers to shoot about 1" groups at 25 yards regularly with a support under the firing hand. Anytime I get a new revolver or dial one in for someone I use both conical and round ball. I have noticed a good amount of hate towards conical but they should never be counted out. I have never had a issue with conical and they shoot great! I will say that round balls are easier to use and buy versus casting and sizing conicals. I have a revolver that shoots .454 round ball and it also shoots .450 concials. Other revolvers that shoot .456 round ball that shoots a .452 and .451 conical. In my experience with conicals I found that you should be able to push them into the cylinder with your finger with little force then seat them with a press.

Once I figure out what size round ball and conicals a revolver shoots I load up 6 tubes of 3F powder. For a .44 cal I load 16-24 in 2 grain increments. For a .36 cal I load 6 tubes of 12-20 or so. The higher number depends on the type of revolver. So for example I load 6 tubes of 16,18,20,22,24 grains of 3F. I shoot the different load in one sitting at a large piece of paper marking and tracking groups by measuring all 6 shots. I also lube and size my conicals in a Lubisizer. Bullets with a square or flat base need to be concentric so as they leave rifling they leave the muzzle evenly and squarely.

When it comes to using filler again, there are different opinions such as using corn meal or whatever. I have tested using filler and not filler with revolvers that shot conicals the best and noticed that filler did not effect the grouping. When I use conicals I load powder, conical, and fill cylinder with lube (borebutter). I would suggest testing grouping with using filler and not using filler. As most loads will be different and filler makes up for using less powder. In the N-SSA we shoot for accuracy so using 16 grains versus a full combat load will increase the gap from conical to forcing cone. So filler makes up for the less powder being used to close that gap.

With all of that being said I do agree that any revolver with a top strap frame like a Rem 1858, Rogers & Spencer or Whitney will be the most consistent and accurate. This is due to having a more solid of a frame (top strap) and not having the rear sight on a hammer.

To get the most out of your revolves I recommend testing both conicals and round ball along with different powder charges. Remember conicals are not plug and play like round balls can be so they need a little more fitting initially. In my conversations with people that do not like conicals have missed a step in figuring out how to use them effectively. Obviously I cannot speak for everyone that says they do not shoot good but I am willing to bet I can get them to shoot just fine. I have made believers out of some anti conical people. My first Nationals I shot individuals 19th overall (out of 350+ shooters) with a bone stock (not tuned or accurized) Euroarms 1858 shooting 18 grains of goex 3F and .450 conicals with no filler.

Know that when asking for revolver load data you will get as many opinions as you will with asking a musket shooter what lube he uses. Oh, also make sure you get a tall front sight that you can cut/file down once you figure out the load that gives you the best group.

[Don Dixon]

The N-SSA statistician very kindly posts distinguished points totals awarded to members for their performance with various firearms after every national match. In evaluating technical posts on the Small Arms thread and other threads on the N-SSA webpage it is useful to also look at the distinguished point lists for a reality check.

Regards,
Don Dixon
2881V

[Maillemaker]

Where do you view those points? Do you have a link?

One trick/problem with the conicals is it is difficult to "eyeball" the correct amount of filler due to how long they are - you may not be able to accurately see the correct depth. With round ball it's pretty easy to eyeball how much filler to pour in and still be able to fully seat the ball.

In the end once I find the correct amount of filler to seat the bullet (of any kind) flush with the chamber mouth I store my filler in pre-filled .36 tubes, just like charges are.

Another reason people may get different results with their load workups is evidently some of these revolvers have different twist rates than others, depending on who made them and when. Even among the same type of revolver.

Steve

[Lou Lou Lou]

Under official information. 144th National DSSA and DSCA standings

[Don Dixon]

Where do you view those points? Do you have a link?

Sign into the N-SSA Forum with your password and authenticator. Go to the "N-SSA Official Information" block. Go to the sticky marked "144th Classification and DSSA/DSCA Points Posted" block. The statistician makes a new post of DSSA/DSCA points and classifications after every national.

Regarding classifications, I might add that I would be more inclined to trust the opinion of a member who doesn't have DSSA/DSCA points but who shoots individual matches and is classified in class 1 rather than class 4. It might be a revolutionary concept, but performance and knowledge are related.

Regards,
Don Dixon
2881V

[Maillemaker]

Here's the link:

https://www.n-ssa.net/vbforum/showthread.php/20994-144th-Classifications-and-DSSA-DSCA-points-posted

Steve

[Maillemaker]

What do the point standings mean?

Steve

[Don Dixon]

See Section 32 of the N-SSA rules for the rules governing the award of the Distinguished Skirmisher badge and Distinguished Shooter awards for musket, carbine, revolver, breechloading rifle, and smoothbore musket. Points go to the individuals who have placed in the top 10 competitors in the grand aggregate and the individual weapons aggregates at the national matches. The match winner receives 10 points, while 10th place receives 1 point. Awards require 25 total points for a bronze Distinguished badge, 100 for a silver badge, and 200 for a gold badge. At the upper level the badges are essentially awards for a lifetime of N-SSA individual competitive shooting excellence.

Regards,
Don Dixon
2881V

[hobbler]

Proper fit and alignment are crucial.
This is an adjustable length .36 caliber mold designed for Pietta's chambers.

11570

[Maillemaker]

Points go to the individuals who have placed in the top 10 competitors in the grand aggregate and the individual weapons aggregates at the national matches. The match winner receives 10 points, while 10th place receives 1 point. Awards require 25 total points for a bronze Distinguished badge, 100 for a silver badge, and 200 for a gold badge. At the upper level the badges are essentially awards for a lifetime of N-SSA individual competitive shooting excellence.

Wow, that's pretty cool! Been doing this going on 10 years and never heard of this.

Steve

[Eggman]

Your friend Lani Harrison has been wearing a distinguished shooter pin for years and years and years.