The "Six Inch Rule"

[Southron Sr.]

The argument of "which rifle or rifle-musket is better," a "two bander" or a "three bander?"

For Skirmishing, the "Six Inch Rule" gives the edge to the rifles with the 33" barrels. WHY? Because with a "two bander" with a 33" barrel there is 6 inches LESS of barrel you have to shove a ramrod and bullet down during the loading cycle and 6 inches LESS of barrel you have to withdraw the ramrod from after the ball is pushed down on top of the powder charge.

Hence. loading "two banders" is faster in the Musket Team Matches...and your team wins or loses depending on time.

Nuff said.

[RaiderANV]

40-33= 7 inch rule??

[John Bly]

Actually the firearm used has very little to do with it. Matches are won with hits on the target. The shooter is the most important thing in the equation. Which is better, the guy who shoots twice a minute and seldom misses or the guy who shoots 5 times a minute and misses most of the time? If all 8 shooters on a musket team each had 2 hits /minute you would win every skirmish. Accuracy wins matches, always has/always will. It doesn't matter if the barrel is 40" or 33". If we all concentrate on making ourselves better shots rather than which gun we shoot we would all be better off.

[Greg Ogdan 110th OVI]

What John said. Period

Greg

[Hal]

I keep looking for the gun that will compensate for my poor marksmanship.

[Jim Brady Knap's Battery]

I keep looking for the gun that will compensate for my poor marksmanship.

That's funny right there.

[John Holland]

My dear friend, John Bly, makes it sound SO easy....all you have to do is have two hits a minute! You start with a loaded musket, etc......you break your first shot, which is followed by a full minute to reload and break the second target.......How hard can that be? HA!

[Lou Lou Lou]

I struggle to ge one hit per minute

[Eggman]

What John said. Period

Greg
Yeah there are lots of ways to miss in this sport. The 110th has managed to master - all - aspects ---- well wait a minute, they were 0 for 35 on blue juicer bottles at Eva (five man teams). Maybe "long and skinny" practice needs some work.

[PoorJack]

Barrel length matters not. Most important hits are.

Ya can't miss fast enough to hit anything.

[Maillemaker]

Doesn't matter how long or short it is if you can't hit the right spot, eh? ;)

Steve

[Southron Sr.]

Agreed- that accuracy trumps in the Musket Team Matches.

However, lets do a theoretical exercise. Say you have two musket teams competing with each other, one team is armed with, say, Enfield Naval Rifles with 33 inch barrels....the other team armed with replica P-53 Enfields with 39 inch barrels.

Also say that ALL the shooters on both teams are excellent shots and never miss. Which team would win? I say the team with the Naval Rifles would simply because Naval Rifles can be loaded faster because they have shorter barrels.

[John Bly]

I only know a few people who have had a perfect skirmish(never missed a target) and there have been maybe a dozen or so in the entire history of the N-SSA who could shoot a musket 4-5 times a minute AND hit the target. People load at a different cadence so your theoretical exercise is pointless. Yes, perhaps most could load a shorter musket a tenth of a second faster but we are talking about the best shooters. When I see a team shoot for 5 minutes and break less than 10 pigeons on the board it doesn't matter how fast they were loading and it seems that they don't care. Maybe they just like to hear the gun go off or like the smell of burned black powder.

[Chris Sweeney]

I see Southron's point. I am 5' 5" and shoot a 3 band smoothbore. It is a struggle sometimes to get the ramrod out in a timely fashion - I usually shoot it well, but there are times when a second or two has made a difference. I suppose if you were one of those oversize folks (5' 9") it wouldn't matter . . .

[B P Shooter]

Cant believe I just spent a few minutes of my time reading all this. Hahaha. But since I'm here...

I shoot a Zouave, so really can't say much and prove it, but wouldn't a longer barrel theoretically have more riflings and offer better accuracy?

[Muley Gil]

Cant believe I just spent a few minutes of my time reading all this. Hahaha. But since I'm here...

I shoot a Zouave, so really can't say much and prove it, but wouldn't a longer barrel theoretically have more riflings and offer better accuracy?

No, it doesn't work that way. Generally, it is finding the right combination of rifling twist, bullet and powder charge.

[John Holland]

The longer the sight radius, the less deviation in human error.....minuscule, but there is a difference.

[Southron Sr.]

Dear John:

I also like to humorously complain that Skirmishers that shoot three banders in the Musket Team Matches have an "unfair advantage" because, on the firing line, the muzzle of a three bander is 6 inches closer to the target than the muzzle of a two bander!

What would be an interesting project; because the N-SSA has been putting a picture of the winning Musket Team at the Nationals on the covers of the following Skirmish Line would be to examine, say, 10 years worth of Skirmish Line covers and count the number of two banders and three banders used by the members of the winning teams.

My guess is that the number of two banders would outnumber the number of three banders used by the members of the winning teams by a fairly large margin. That would validate the "6 inch rule."

HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!!!

[John Holland]

Southron - Shooting with the 44th NY, I was on three 1st Place National Musket Teams, all before there were classifications. I used a full length M-1861 Springfield Rifle Musket (Bill Large barrel) and only missed one shot on each of those National Championship wins! OK, full disclosure, I was nearly 50 years younger than I am now!

[Southron Sr.]

Dear John

CONGRATULATIONS on being on teams that won Nationals!!!

Happy New Year

Southron

[tony 1st regt]

"Generally, it is finding the right combination of rifling twist, bullet and powder charge." Don't forget LUBE!!!!!

John is right, Marines have a saying that goes something like "It is not the noise, but the hits"

And a Happy New Year to all and the start of another skirmish season...

[OldSalt4570]

I keep looking for the gun that will compensate for my poor marksmanship.

Hal, your "poor" marksmanship is truly amazing at how many targets fall!

[Dave Fox]

In some circumstances a 3-bander's extra bore length uses up the bullet lube before the bullet exists the barrel leading to increased fouling, loss of accuracy, and difficulty loading.

[Harry Gaul]

Not a great shot by any means. In the old days I shot a three bander and was fairly successful. Two band Artilley models were becoming popular, and I switched to a two bander because at Fort Shenadoah the wind blows from left to right and the extra length made it difficult to get and stay on target. In addition to the previous comments, I am proposing that the extra length makes it more difficult to get on target and stay on target as the wind blows. The two bander is more balanced, less firearm exposed to the wind plus practice plus bullet/load development plus younger eyes and arms results in more hits and better scores.

Its a Physics thing.

Harry Gaul
Forney Battalion
03626v

[Hal]

Thanks Allan. Sometimes the stars just line up, but not always.