smoothbore accuracy

[Tom]

Would musket lube be better?

[Lou Lou Lou]

Try doing what you are doin BUT after the wood, assemble the rounds. Then use case to triple dip in MCM lube

[Lou Lou Lou]

Not wood but wood. Dang auto correct

[Lou Lou Lou]

Alox, Alox Alox

[george7542]

In my potsdam 2f Swiss 715 ball rolled between wood rasps set in tubes then dipped in musket lube thinned out with a little Crisco can load around 15 shot before I have any problems loading

[PoorJack]

Absolutely NO Alox here. My 1842 Macon seems to shoot rather well with 65gr 3f, ball roughed by farrier file and exposed end double dipped in Lens Lube. Load with lube side to powder, 10+ shots before getting crunchy.

[bobanderson]

The fouling accumulated near the breech tells me you are using Swiss. In my experimenting, the same fouling ring happened about 6” from the muzzle with plain Goex 3f. It also seemed that it didn’t have anything to do with what and how much lube you use. When I switched to Goex Express, the same as Old Eynsford 3f, the fouling ring went away. I’m of the opinion that the liquid alox turns right into carbon and eventually fouls out the barrel.
I use two farrier’s files and roll the balls until they are a snug slip fit down my Hoyt lined H&P. I got a 6” piece of Bobby’s cutoff to use as a filing gauge. Every round I shoot goes through the gauge before I load it into a tube. I load them dry with no lube and can get about 20 shots without noticeable fouling. The last shot loads about the same as the second one, and not all that different from the first one.
(I also have a 30” Macon with a Hoyt barrel that uses the same projectiles.)

[Maillemaker]

I shoot 70 grains 3F Goex, and also have noticed the "fouling ring" during shooting. Not sure exactly where it is in the bore, though I think it's closer to the muzzle for me.

Anyway I tried shooting them rough, rough+alox, and non-rough, and without lube things got crunchier faster.

I don't think Alox is a particularly good lube in this application and I don't think it is intended to function as lube so much as a windage-eater for the ball while in the bore.

I've not experimented with using actual lube with round balls but it seems a messy proposition to me. I don't have any problems getting through N-SSA competitions with rough Alox balls.

Steve

[Tom]

Thank you everyone. Mailemaker I think you are on the 4th LA and hopefully I'll see you soon. I have been shooting Swiss 3 F in my smoothbore. I tried to get the kind of Old Eynsford blackpowder but couldn't for the upcoming skirmish. I'll order some in the future. Thanks to Lou and others. When I run out of ideas, sometimes this board helps me get more. I should get this ol' smuv bo shooting good. Just give it time. Thanks again everyone.

[gjwarren]

Yup - see you in a week Tom. Just come over to the Escort tables and look for the really really good looking guy.
Best of luck with the smoothie!Never had anything but bad results with alox and black powder. I rough my SB balls with 2 farrier raps after filing off sprue. Learned from Dom (RIP) to rough em up alot and simply use axel grease for lube. I can shoot my .710 roughed, greased ball in my Potsdam all day with no problem. Fast, easy, accurate & not as messy as you'd think, but I use 'dog bone' double ended tubes, one end powder, one end ball, so there is no wasted powder on the ball. Using musket lube, I had the problem you described loading hard last 2 inches & wasting a shot.

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[bobanderson]

Thank you everyone. Eggman I hope to meet you at the next Deep South Skirmish. I don't know who you are, but I hope we meet. I am on the 44th GA and we are usually the next bench to the Escort. Mailemaker I think you are on the 4th LA and hopefully I'll see you also. Mr. Anderson, you are spot on, I have been shooting Swiss 3 F in my smoothbore. I tried to get the kind of blackpowder you mentioned but couldn't for the upcoming skirmish. I'll order some in the future. Thanks to Lou and others, I'm going to try some musket lube and perhaps some dry rounds just to see how those work. When I run out of ideas, sometimes this board helps me get more. I should get this ol' smuv bo shooting good. Just give it time. Thanks again everyone.

Another thing I tried was to boil the round balls, then dip them in my musket lube heated in the microwave. Heating the balls in this manner gave me a much thinner coating of lube, similar to a thin coat of alox. This helped with the eventual fouling, but I couldn’t get enough rounds down range to complete an individual event in Virginia.
I shot all last season without lubing a single smoothbore round and had my best year yet. Even medalled in Virginia at 25 yards. No small feat with the quality of the competition.

[Jim Brady Knap's Battery]

Watching all this magic Ju-Ju speak on smoothbore loads has awoken Lefty from his long sleep. He perused all the posts and as he did I could hear him muttering, " If you can't smear it on a cracker and eat it then it don't belong on a blackpowder projectile." I've always heeded Lefty's advice and it had served me well when I shot smoothbore individuals and team matches.

[henrymstr]

Hey Brady.......u must chase that slicked up cracker with that lime green group tightner for proper performance.......its in the manual.

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[Jim Brady Knap's Battery]

Can't. They stopped making the Dog. :( But it may be a good thing since we don't party like we used to. Getting old will do that to you.

[ms3635v]

I shoot an original 1849 Harpers Ferry with a Hoyt liner (.687") and use Moose .680" round balls, no sprues to remove. One coat of Alox and 60 grains of Old Eynsford 2F. Shoots great and never get a tight spot.

[John Holland]

Mike, do you have to brush between events?

[Steve Weems]

Never had anything but bad results with alox and black powder. I rough my SB balls with 2 farrier raps after filing off sprue. Learned from Dom (RIP) to rough em up alot and simply use axel grease for lube. I can shoot my .710 roughed, greased ball in my Potsdam all day with no problem. Fast, easy, accurate & not as messy as you'd think, but I use 'dog bone' double ended tubes, one end powder, one end ball, so there is no wasted powder on the ball. Using musket lube, I had the problem you described loading hard last 2 inches & wasting a shot.

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Where do you get the “Dog Bone” tubes.

[bobanderson]

I got a PM from 44th Ga Tom and replied the same way, but then thought the comments would be helpful to others. Seems like smoothbores have become the most talked about toy on the forum in the last couple of years.

Anyways, here’s the text from my PM...

Re: smoothbore accuracy
Quote Originally Posted by Tom
Bob,

I went Monday to practice with my smoothbore. I could not get any Old Eynsford but got some Goex 3f. I tried out some of the things you mentioned in my post. I put a single coat of lube on some roughed up round balls and shot 15 rounds. I hit an 8 inch circle 50 yards away 12 out of 15 times, pretty good for my smoothbore. I think the three I missed were because of one or two things - the bore got crunchy after 9 rounds shot and/or the rounds could have also been undersized. After 5 shots I used a bore brush but did not use wet/dry patches to remove extra fouling. Thanks again. I wish I could practice more but must go to a skirmish this week. All the best

Tom
3f Goex is made with a different charcoal which is why you get crunchy. When they developed Old Eynsford (originally called Express) they went for higher velocity and softer fouling.
As I said, in my testing, Swiss created a fouling ring near the breech and Goex 3f about 4” from the muzzle. I’m convinced alox contributes to those fouled spots. It will take a real leap of faith to shoot the balls dry, but once you get the combination of size and powder charge right, you won’t regret it.
Here’s my drill again.
I cast hard lead round balls from an Elka round ball mould. I rougn them between 2 farrrier’s files until they pass with very little resistance through a short section of Hoyt barrel that measures .687 to match my H&P and my Type 1 Macon smoothbore. Once gauged, they go into the tube dry. My powder charge for both guns is 45 grains of Goex Express 3f. (I bought a ton of it when it was discontinued. Mr. Venskoske told me the new powder, Old Eynsford, is the same thing.) I do bump the powder charge to 50 grains when I use the Macon at 50 yards.
I have the Macon because my 15 year old grandson shoots with me on the 1st Michigan. My weapon of choice is the H&P, but the Macon loads faster and shoots almost as well.
One last tip. If you need to brush, use the “tornado style” twisted stainless steel brush instead of the straight bristle ones. It seems to clean better which should get you longer strings.
Good luck.

[Tom]

I was able to squeeze one more trip to the range. Shot at 50 yards, roughed up rounds, one coat of lube, Goex 3f. 15 out of 15 in an 8 inch circle. Hope to do it again soon!!

[ms3635v]

No John, I use one wet patch then dry patches. I never really liked using brushes because, at least to me, it just re-arranges the fouling in the barrel.

[gjwarren]

Where do you get the “Dog Bone” tubes.Lodge wood used to have them, but I got extra from a team mate. Ask for their source. Red or yellow ends and dividers.

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[sjezior]

Commander of Battery H makes and sells them: 20 for $10 + shipping / handling (or pick up at Nationals). Email him at https://www.batteryh.com/contact to ask questions or order.

[John Matuszek, 04947]

I still have some and can make more if people wish to use them. I ran out of the yellow ends and now am using red instead. Just contact me if you have questions. I will make sure I bring some out to Spring Nationals.

[gjwarren]

I need some tubes. They get stepped on sometimes.

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