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Thread: Smith enigma

  1. #11
    John Bly is offline
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    Try giving a little texture to the rear of the locking block on the frame. Do this by placing some 240 grit emery cloth on the block and tapping lightly with a hammer. Do not rub it. This will increase the friction between the lugs and increase the force needed to open the action. It might help. It did on one I had several years ago.

  2. #12
    PETER HUGHES is offline
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    I have shot several Smiths over the years. Original and Pietta repro. Same or similar powder charges. 28-32 gr 3F Goex, Cream of Wheat filler. Crisco-beeswax 2/1 mix. I have had one of the Pietta repro's do this, and I know of at least one other Pietta that does it. My belief is that it is the top strap has lost it's spring like function, but I'm not sure, it could also be the top blocks are wearing although the corners are sharp ? As I still have the repro and no longer use it although it shoots well, it would be nice to have an answer? I bought another top strap, but it needs to be fit to the gun, so I haven't gotten to it yet.


    Anyone else?


    Pete Hughes 2029V 120th NYVI

  3. #13
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    Recall, the member with this issue has it on THREE different guns...

    The top straps and lugs are all very sharp and tight on all three...

    -Mike
    Mike 'Bootsie' Bodner
    Palmetto Sharpshooter's, Commander
    9996V

  4. #14
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    Jack, if feasible, try having someone or yourself video the Smith(s) with a high speed video camera while being shot/fired and then slow the video down to see what is happening during the firing sequence... Safely of course... Just a thought...
    Francis J. Miller Jr. (Herb)
    Lancaster Fencibles / 79th PVI
    Middle Atlantic Region
    153-MA - 2601V
    Middle Atlantic Region Provost Marshal
    N-SSA National Provost Guard

  5. #15
    PoorJack is offline
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    Ok so I measured the case length of the several tube types we use. This is NOT loaded COAL.

    Black Plastic-
    New- 1.420-1.440
    Used- 1.420-1.450

    Orange Urethane
    New- 1.430
    Used- 1.430
    Note that these are quite a bit softer than the black plastic

    Brass (ones I have been working with)
    1.393-1.399

    From what I have found out, the correct length of the Smith chamber is 1.40. I haven't measured my Smith chambers yet, but again, none of them exhibited any tendency to jump open prior to switching lube. I like the orange urethane cases because they are a bit elastic and easy to extract whereas the black ones can stick a bit. The brass ones are looking like they have the most accuracy potential if I can get this ironed out. At 50yds, the first several that didn't jump open cut just over a 1in group. The next 4 that jumped open shot about 5 inches lower but still into a 2in group.
    Last edited by PoorJack; 10-25-2017 at 10:31 AM.
    "A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition"
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    YadkinValleyRangers@gmail.com
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  6. #16
    CAGerringer is offline
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    Same thing...all three guns? Are you absolutely, positively, certain that your powder or filler hasn't been contaminated with even a minute amount of modern powder? It would take crazy over-pressure to force open a Smith locking device that's operating properly. And on three different guns!?!? My advice is throw out all your powder, lube, & filler and start over, before you hurt yourself!
    Charlie Gerringer
    Old Dominion Dragoons

  7. #17
    PoorJack is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAGerringer View Post
    Same thing...all three guns? Are you absolutely, positively, certain that your powder or filler hasn't been contaminated with even a minute amount of modern powder? It would take crazy over-pressure to force open a Smith locking device that's operating properly. And on three different guns!?!? My advice is throw out all your powder, lube, & filler and start over, before you hurt yourself!
    Charlie Gerringer
    Old Dominion Dragoons
    Ok, so I'm going to toss out 5lbs powder purchased from Back Creek at the last Nationals like less than 3 weeks ago..... really??

    Powder measure has seen nothing but black since purchased new and is the same one being used with all my other skirmish guns, including 2 Colt Contracts that shoot into 1in at 50yds. No other guns are acting up, but they're all front stuffers. Testing regimine includes weighing every single charge and bullet for any gun under load development. And yes, I've verified BOTH my digital scales and my gravity one agree. My smokeless measure is on another bench or attached to a Dillon.

    Filler? What filler other than the same box of grits I used before this started up. Maybe Yankee mealy worms engaging in sabotage?

    That leaves only lube coupled possibly with case length. I'm going to fall back to my previous lube to rule out one or the other on Friday.

    One other thing Charlie, this aint my first day on a reloading bench or a range including precision rifle, NRA HP, IDPA, IPSC, USPSA and I still have my first RCBS single stage from 40 years ago mounted next to a Dillon.
    "A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition"
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  8. #18
    CAGerringer is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoorJack View Post
    Ok, so I'm going to toss out 5lbs powder purchased from Back Creek at the last Nationals like less than 3 weeks ago..... really??

    Powder measure has seen nothing but black since purchased new and is the same one being used with all my other skirmish guns, including 2 Colt Contracts that shoot into 1in at 50yds. No other guns are acting up, but they're all front stuffers. Testing regimine includes weighing every single charge and bullet for any gun under load development. And yes, I've verified BOTH my digital scales and my gravity one agree. My smokeless measure is on another bench or attached to a Dillon.

    Filler? What filler other than the same box of grits I used before this started up. Maybe Yankee mealy worms engaging in sabotage?

    That leaves only lube coupled possibly with case length. I'm going to fall back to my previous lube to rule out one or the other on Friday.

    One other thing Charlie, this aint my first day on a reloading bench or a range including precision rifle, NRA HP, IDPA, IPSC, USPSA and I still have my first RCBS single stage from 40 years ago mounted next to a Dillon.
    Jack, you can do what you want, but I've shot Len's Lube and 30 grains of 3F Goex in my Smith for years and never had it jump open...ever.
    I'm not questioning your knowledge, but I'm sure the Gent in the second phase of the Musket Match at Nationals a couple of years ago, was very experienced also...but, "Stuff happens".
    So...good luck. Looking forward to finding out what's the culprit. (I'm leaning to the Yankee mealy worms.)
    Charlie Gerringer
    Old Dominion Dragoons
    Last edited by CAGerringer; 10-25-2017 at 11:26 PM.

  9. #19
    John Holland is offline Moderator
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    I must make a clarification at this point, lest anyone around the World who may be reading this thinks someone actually "...blew himself up..." at one of our matches. There was a catastrophic failure of an original musket on the firing line two years ago. Subsequent in depth investigation showed the individual had inadvertently loaded some rounds from a can of powder marked "2FF DuPont" which he had received from a friends estate. Unfortunately the friend had used the can to store some smokeless powder. The recipient did not notice the difference, hence the failure.

    In the future please refrain from saying one of our members "...blew himself up..."

    Thank you.

    John Holland
    Moderator

  10. #20
    CAGerringer is offline
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    Sorry, John. I am just concerned that Poor Jack will "catastrophicly failure himself up", if he keeps shooting these faulty rounds.
    Respectfully,
    Charlie Gerringer
    Old Dominion Dragoons

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